[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

Any BMW
Any Lotus
Any minivan
Any pickup truck
Any Jeep

And yet you're on a BMW board...

Mine have been great.

[Clark_Kent]

Originally Posted by ezaircon4jc

And yet you're on a BMW board...

Mine have been great.

You are correct. BMW was good for me, owned a few of them, and then it wasn't so I moved on. I don't believe in brand loyalty and I'm not the only one. Many former BMW owners stuck around here long after they cut ties with the brand.

[ezaircon4jc]

Originally Posted by Clark_Kent

You are correct. BMW was good for me, owned a few of them, and then it wasn't so I moved on. I don't believe in brand loyalty and I'm not the only one. Many former BMW owners stuck around here long after they cut ties with the brand.

I was just bustin' your chops a little . I'm only "brand loyal" until there is a reason not to be. There are a brands I will not even consider, which, now that I've been spoiled, include all the American brands for various reasons. After years of FWD appliances (and buying into the propaganda), I've become a RWD snob, which limits my options.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

SUVs, trucks, Teslas, Audis, Mercs, muscle cars, etc. None satisfy my desires for being lightweight and engaging daily drivers. I will say the Camaro is a decent handling car, but still pretty numb and serious-feeling.

No kids? SUVs are awesome and the newer ones feel more and more like cars. The X3 and X5 loaners I had handled better than cars from 10 years ago.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by JP10

Tell ya what, our telluride is awesome. Best bang for your buck large suv hands down. About to crack 40k miles, no issues. Is it exciting, hell no. Do I need it to be since it’s for my wife and kid, hell no. Great car though.

I like the Telluride, but I hate the Hyundai and Kia dealer experience. They all mark up their cars and take a dump on the value proposition. Did you pay over MSRP?

For me, the VW Atlas checked the boxes. Value was excellent, I paid MSRP during the pandemic, its huge, utilitarian, and imho looks great with the sideboards. Not the most reliable since we've had a few minor recalls, but mechanically it's been great. Floaty and not the greatest to drive, but like you, it's for the wife and kids so it doesn't matter.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by jmg

No kids? SUVs are awesome and the newer ones feel more and more like cars. The X3 and X5 loaners I had handled better than cars from 10 years ago.

No kids. When that happens will definitely need one SUV in the household. But it'll never be my personal driver. Some like the Macan, Stelvio, X3M are pretty good to drive but still don't possess that light low and oversteer-capable experience of proper sport sedans.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

No kids. When that happens will definitely need one SUV in the household. But it'll never be my personal driver. Some like the Macan, Stelvio, X3M are pretty good to drive but still don't possess that light low and oversteer-capable experience of proper sport sedans.

I have a large 3 row SUV for kid hauling and an M4 for myself. In looking for a daily personal car, I find it hard to justify another sedan with so close a similarity in convenience as an M4. Hatchbacks or small to midsize SUV’s tend to offer enough to justify an additional car. Maybe even a truck. I can’t picture myself getting an M340i while already having an M4, know what I mean?

[ASAP]

I almost feel like the reverse of some of the comments... if ur to have an only car or a car that necessitates any practicality, imho, you should strictly have an SUV as your first car. The modern SUVs offer a ton comfort, awesome livability and some more sporty ones like x3 m40i or X5 offer a good driving experience.

I almost question why would anyone buy a 3 series or 5 series if they aren't M cars lol?
They offer nothing outside of a lower CG which in a 5 series... who cares?

Performance is clearly not your focus and modern SUVs offer far more in usability than they lose in performance to the comparabale sedan.

My perfect garage is a sports car w my suv and I am good... m3, m4, m2 comp or the like.

[AmuroRay]

I don’t like SUVs - huge penalty in upfront costs, and ownership costs, for moderate increase in convenience. Heaven forbid you want to drive for fun, now you are throwing a school bus around curvy roads.

I’ll pass.

[bagekko]

Have you ever driven an X# with DHP, IAS, M-xDrive, etc? In my X7 its very impressive, believe the X5 can have all that and must be crazy, all of that in an X3M if available would prolly beat most sports cars from 20-30 yrs ago on the track.

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

I don’t like SUVs - huge penalty in upfront costs, and ownership costs, for moderate increase in convenience. Heaven forbid you want to drive for fun, now you are throwing a school bus around curvy roads.

I’ll pass.

[freakystyly]

Originally Posted by jmg

No kids? SUVs are awesome and the newer ones feel more and more like cars. The X3 and X5 loaners I had handled better than cars from 10 years ago.

Know what else feel more and more like cars? Cars...

There just aren't many choices of fun to drive <4000lb vehicles anymore. And I mean fun to drive "for me" not for everyone.

[bagekko]

Sub 4k lol almost nothing is under that fun or not, isn't the new M3 3990 and the F90 M5 is close to what 4500lbs. Ah the days back when my Z3 was sub 3000lbs.

Originally Posted by freakystyly

Know what else feel more and more like cars? Cars...

There just aren't many choices of fun to drive <4000lb vehicles anymore. And I mean fun to drive "for me" not for everyone.

[jmg]

Originally Posted by freakystyly

Know what else feel more and more like cars? Cars...

There just aren't many choices of fun to drive <4000lb vehicles anymore. And I mean fun to drive "for me" not for everyone.

That’s why you get both. Different tools for different tasks.

[bagekko]

LOL that mentality is dangerous, it requires more than two, and you end up with 6 cars like me.

Originally Posted by jmg

That’s why you get both. Different tools for different tasks.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by bagekko

Have you ever driven an X# with DHP, IAS, M-xDrive, etc? In my X7 its very impressive, believe the X5 can have all that and must be crazy, all of that in an X3M if available would prolly beat most sports cars from 20-30 yrs ago on the track.

Yeah, I’ll pass.

[JP10]

Originally Posted by jmg

I like the Telluride, but I hate the Hyundai and Kia dealer experience. They all mark up their cars and take a dump on the value proposition. Did you pay over MSRP?

For me, the VW Atlas checked the boxes. Value was excellent, I paid MSRP during the pandemic, its huge, utilitarian, and imho looks great with the sideboards. Not the most reliable since we've had a few minor recalls, but mechanically it's been great. Floaty and not the greatest to drive, but like you, it's for the wife and kids so it doesn't matter.

I hear ya, my experience was fine. Asked if it was available, flew to buy it, 30mins for the paperwork, out the door. Got it for MSRP $41,900 for an EX just the way we wanted. 1.9% rate too. Perfectly fine for her, and the v6 is peppy, but not too peppy, which is great haha.

[floridaorange]

Originally Posted by bagekko

Have you ever driven an X# with DHP, IAS, M-xDrive, etc? In my X7 its very impressive, believe the X5 can have all that and must be crazy, all of that in an X3M if available would prolly beat most sports cars from 20-30 yrs ago on the track.

I have - x5m - super fun to drive, especially with dinan exhaust

[F32Fleet]

Any BMW with more than 6 cylinders.

[3.0L]

Camry.

[karcio424]

Originally Posted by F32Fleet

Any BMW with more than 6 cylinders.

Or less than...
I feel like 3 and 4-pot motors have too shitty working culture. Some of the petrol ones still sound like a diesel, so what's the point? Everything with more than 6 pots is far too unreliable if bought used, at least from my experience. I'd have no problem buying 8, 10 or 12-pot as new, and doing maintenance my way though.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by karcio424

Or less than...
I feel like 3 and 4-pot motors have too shitty working culture. Some of the petrol ones still sound like a diesel, so what's the point? Everything with more than 6 pots is far too unreliable if bought used, at least from my experience. I'd have no problem buying 8, 10 or 12-pot as new, and doing maintenance my way though.

Solenoid injectors make them sound like diesels.

Piezoelectric are much quieter but expensive.

[Mosaud1998]

Originally Posted by 3.0L

Camry.

What about the Camry TRD