[Maverick241]

Originally Posted by techwhiz1

https://futurism.com/the-byte/tesla-...ngtechnologies

FSD runs through dear without a hint of stopping.

Great cherry picked article from an obviously biased snark rag showing a situation that no human (or LIDAR equipped) car would have avoided. But REDUNDANCY!! amirite?

[bunker]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

Even when you include all the factors, EVs are still way more environmentally friendly than ICE vehicles.

You can look at these, or any other legitimate source and you can learn:
https://earthjustice.org/article/ele...%20or%20diesel.
https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/el...-vehicle-myths
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/09/12502...nmental-impact
https://www.npr.org/2024/09/23/nx-s1...ent-skepticism
https://www.statkraft.com/newsroom/n...ordinary-cars/

It's so nice when someone links to actual facts. Makes the conspiracy wonks go nuts. Thank you, friend from a blue state.

Personally, I think the profile of this car looks brilliant.

[ToMorNotToM]

Mein gott! Nein!!!!!

[HomieTheClown]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

Even when you include all the factors, EVs are still way more environmentally friendly than ICE vehicles.
-

What about the lack of engine revving or muffler sounds? Does any one who is pro electric M3 going to miss that. Besides the supposed excitement of the driving these cars with its dynamic handling and sports suspension, the sounds of an BEV would be lack the excitement of what makes a BMW (to me at least) a joy to own.

I guess I was wondering if anyone else cared about this???

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by HomieTheClown

What about the lack of engine revving or muffler sounds? Does any one who is pro electric M3 going to miss that. Besides the supposed excitement of the driving these cars with its dynamic handling and sports suspension, the sounds of an BEV would be lack the excitement of what makes a BMW (to me at least) a joy to own.

I guess I was wondering if anyone else cared about this???

That’s true. Everything is a compromise. When we switched from horses to cars we lost some things for sure. But we’ve gained a lot more.

[ubercruise]

Originally Posted by HomieTheClown

What about the lack of engine revving or muffler sounds? Does any one who is pro electric M3 going to miss that. Besides the supposed excitement of the driving these cars with its dynamic handling and sports suspension, the sounds of an BEV would be lack the excitement of what makes a BMW (to me at least) a joy to own.

I guess I was wondering if anyone else cared about this???

Of course people care. As a kid I always wanted a car with a big loud engine, and I still enjoy some of them. BMW engines usually sound pretty good (at least the I6), but I find 99% of loud cars on the road otherwise annoying these days. Maybe it's my "old man yells at cloud" moment (alas I've only got a few decades under my belt), but I love sitting in my backyard and barely hearing the Rivian Amazon truck going by vs the loud and odorous gas/diesel box trucks.

I'd still have an ICE as a weekend car to do some mountain driving for pleasure, there's joy in shifting gears and controlling the powerband, but for commuting having my jerky turbo ICE didn't make much sense which is why I made the switch.

TL;DR: there's merits for both for sure, and sound is one thing EVs can't really do, though Dodge apparently is trying.

[Slowphiveo]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

That’s true. Everything is a compromise. When we switched from horses to cars we lost some things for sure. But we’ve gained a lot more.

Horses still exist for enthusiasts. My hope is that a niche industry will pop up to support ICE vehicles for enthusiasts. I mean...there are even small companies that manufacture armor for medieval reenactors. Just because the world has passed a technology by, doesn't mean it needs to disappear completely.

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by Slowphiveo

Horses still exist for enthusiasts. My hope is that a niche industry will pop up to support ICE vehicles for enthusiasts. I mean...there are even small companies that manufacture armor for medieval reenactors. Just because the world has passed a technology by, doesn't mean it needs to disappear completely.

I agree with this. I think I’ve read somewhere that Italian government is working on regulations that would allow niche ‘recreational’ vehicles like Ferraris. That could be a model. In the US I think ICE vehicles will exist for a long time, due to geography and culture. Just not in urban areas, and not from European brands.

[///Andy]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

I agree with this. I think I’ve read somewhere that Italian government is working on regulations that would allow niche ‘recreational’ vehicles like Ferraris. That could be a model. In the US I think ICE vehicles will exist for a long time, due to geography and culture. Just not in urban areas, and not from European brands.

Your biased sources on how electric is more environmentally friendly than ICE are about as idiotic as your arguments.

There is a reason European manufactures, Porsche for example, are reverting course on electrification. Lack of sustainability being one of the major drivers. Much to your dismay, urban hell holes will continue to run on fossil fuels... which is the reason you have roads, food, buildings, shelter, heat, basically every necessity of life.

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by ///Andy

Your biased sources on how electric is more environmentally friendly than ICE are about as idiotic as your arguments.

The sources I’ve shared have factual data and numbers in them. If you have a counter argument over all those calculations, provide your own calculations. Maybe you can publish a scientific study that opposes all the “idiotic” established science! Because normal people who know what they’re talking about on these topics don’t just dismiss all of them as ‘biased’, they explain the errors in if there’s any. I’m totally sure you found some, you have evidence that you’ll publish and we will go back to glorious V8s! If you call it “idiotic” your claims should be easily provable?

I really don’t understand people who think there’s a giant conspiracy from New Zealand to Japan to Europe to US among all scientists and all governments to kill ICE cars. Anyone who has a little knowledge on this, would know very well that entire Western civilization would love to keep ICE cars (Especially Germany and US) but the evidence is so overwhelming that no one with a slight understanding can push for this BS anymore…

[Rat_House]

Side profile giving me Evo X vibes

[jmxtrem]

Looks Good ,they have to make something Big

[GG///M3]

Originally Posted by hova00

No thanks! EV’s are not the future and that has been proven by other manufacturers that tried. They’ve halted production and started to reverse course in their claims of an EV future.

EV’s lose over 50% of their value within the 1st year. That’s 4-5% depreciation a month.

Tesla, Audi, Porsche, Ford, Chevy & Dodge all have similar results and their quarterly earnings reflect that no one buys them.

As far as environmentally friendly that is a also a narrative pushed by the political agenda.

Correct.

[Cortexiphan]

Originally Posted by hova00

EV’s lose over 50% of their value within the 1st year. That’s 4-5% depreciation a month.

No they don't. Only some EVs do, as some ICE cars.

https://www.cars.com/shopping/result...=all&zip=10001

[hova00]

Originally Posted by Cortexiphan

No they don't. Only some EVs do, as some ICE cars.

https://www.cars.com/shopping/results/?stock_type=used&makes%5B%5D=bmw&models%5B%5D=bmw-ix&maximum_distance=all&zip=10001

The link you provided proves the depreciation is extreme on the EV’s.

The iX models listed that you provided show an asking price that is 50% of the original on several of the vehicles listed.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by techwhiz1

Due to Regen brakes last 2x as long as an ICE car.

This is an incorrect blanket statement. Braking longevity/performance is car-specific. My Exige stops better and the brakes will last longer than any EV ever made. Also, the CCB's on my M2 are the same...and aren't nearly as detrimental to the environment.

I acknowledge the benefits of regen, but they are overshadowed by weight, which will always win in the end.

[techwhiz1]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

This is an incorrect blanket statement. Braking longevity/performance is car-specific. My Exige stops better and the brakes will last longer than any EV ever made. Also, the CCB's on my M2 are the same...and aren't nearly as detrimental to the environment.

I acknowledge the benefits of regen, but they are overshadowed by weight, which will always win in the end.

You Exige weighs how much? 2500lbs?
And you are now comparing carbon ceramics to steel brakes. Carbon ceramics also cost almost $9000 as an option and $15k to retrofit, so please let's not go there. That is a specious argument because CCB are an outlier even on BMWs. The take rate on the option is low.

My daughter's first car a Fiat 500e needed no brake service and had 60% left at 40k miles.

Her first Chevy Bolt was turned in with 45k miles and 60% brakes.

Her current Chevy Bolt has almost 50k miles and still has more than 50% pads.

My i4 can regen the equivalent of 260hp. That is about 50% of the max acceleration. With BMW when you brake you have no idea whether the brakes or regen is being used.

In general an average EV will wear brakes at about 50% of the rate of the average ICE vehicle. That is not speculation do some research.