[ajvee]

Guys,

My friend is just getting out of a horrible timing chain experience with a 2005 Audi S4. He wants to get a sporty car within a $20K budget with at least 280 HP (please just treat this as a stringent requirement as it is his personal preference). He would prefer mileage under 68K. Here are the requirements again:

Budget: $20K
Tranny: Manual preferred, but good auto ok
HP: 280+
Miles: Less than 68K
Concerns: Reliability is a high priority after recent audi experience.
Drivetrain: RWD, AWD preferred but FWD ok as well.

So far he is thinking about a 335i or 370Z. I would appreciate your help in guiding him.

Cheers.

[son_of_siggy]

High mileage 335i, STi, Evo, 350z all fit those requirements really.

My friend and I test drove a 1-generation old STi, and while it drove nice and had pickup, the interior felt juvenile, as if it was tailored to the high school crowd that drove it. I bought a 12' Limited STi a few years later, and that felt much more adult, but you won't find those under 20k yet.

[blutattoo]

I suppose a mustang rules out the reliability factor, but for less than twenty grand you'll be hard pressed to match that criteria unless you sacrifice the mileage limit.

You could always get a used Miata and put a turbo on it or a mazdaspeed miata that has already had some work done to it. A older 350Z or WRX would be probably the most viable. Evo's and STI's don't lose their value much at least not here in CA so under 20k would only be for a high mileage salvage title car.

20k could probably get you a e46 m3, but reliability might be an issue. I love them, but I'm not sold on the older smg tranny.

[son_of_siggy]

Mustangs aren't plagued with issues, and parts are cheap enough. Cheap power too! If you like the style go for one.

[GammaZeta]

Z3M for $12,000

+

Mods for $7,000 (supercharger, suspension, etc.)

=

A 400 hp beast that is a collector's item.

[ragingclue]

Originally Posted by son_of_siggy

Mustangs aren't plagued with issues, and parts are cheap enough.

+1

Certainly way more reliable than a 335 and some of the other suggestions in here.

[Red Bread]

Thankfully there are very few 280+hp fwd cars, so we can just avoid that topic.

E46 M3, 135i or possibly a clueless dealer and a Z4 M Coupe.

[ajvee]

Gotta love the enthusiasts with the modded car recommendations!

This has to definitely be a stock car chaps.

[Zeros and ones]

Originally Posted by GammaZeta

Z3M for $12,000

+

Mods for $7,000 (supercharger, suspension, etc.)

=

A 400 hp beast that is a collector's item.

+1... oh man..... teeheee

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by GammaZeta

Z3M for $12,000

+

Mods for $7,000 (supercharger, suspension, etc.)

=

A 400 hp beast that is a collector's item.

If you do all of that, it's no longer collectors item material...

[HotIce]

BR-Z/FR-S

[idrift4wd]

Originally Posted by ajvee

Guys,

My friend is just getting out of a horrible timing chain experience with a 2005 Audi S4. He wants to get a sporty car within a $20K budget with at least 280 HP (please just treat this as a stringent requirement as it is his personal preference). He would prefer mileage under 68K. Here are the requirements again:

Budget: $20K
Tranny: Manual preferred, but good auto ok
HP: 280+
Miles: Less than 68K
Concerns: Reliability is a high priority after recent audi experience.
Drivetrain: RWD, AWD preferred but FWD ok as well.

So far he is thinking about a 335i or 370Z. I would appreciate your help in guiding him.

Cheers.

335i is not reliable as the 370z but it will fit his price range. You can find one with around 50k miles for 20k. (i got mine for 20k with 44k)

S2000 (turbo )

mustang GT or Pontiac GTO/ G8

is350

g37 coupe/sedan.

sti/evo

[moonsin]

G35/7, 350z/370z, sti maybe?

[GammaZeta]

Originally Posted by minigearhead

not with those mods...
hard to believe it'll be so reliable or service and parts will be cheap...

Sure it will. The S52 is a pretty reliable engine. You could also get the supercharger used if you wanted from an E36 M3.

[Bingobimmer]

sti
335
mustang
can't go wrong with any of those

[TwinTurboIS]

The requirements are a little vague but if 2 seats are enough, a late model C5 Corvette meets all your criteria. Tons of cargo room if you opt for the non-Z06 body style. Now if you can live with a decent amount of cargo room, the C5 Z06 is a performance bargain!

(Admittedly though, a well maintained Z06 will cost north of 20K.)

[CAPSGOD]

996 Carrera, C55 AMG, E46 M3

[flyinb501]

I find it hard to believe that a lot of those options fit his budget.

[DSB335d]

Originally Posted by flyinb501

I find it hard to believe that a lot of those options fit his budget.

He would be looking at about 10+yr old cars to find the above mentioned under $20K.

[See5]

If he wants something fast, I'd try to find a C5 Z06. A C5 coupe works as well. Don't know why people pass those cars up on their list but this is a BMW forum. Yeah, the interior isn't anything to speak of but my 14 year old C5 hardtop was damn near bulletproof in the time I had it. I sold it and the buyer had it at Barber 2 days later. Ran the quarter in the mid to high 12's and could outturn just about everycar listed so far.

I like the GTO too.

[Ti335]

Originally Posted by ajvee

Guys,

My friend is just getting out of a horrible timing chain experience with a 2005 Audi S4. He wants to get a sporty car within a $20K budget with at least 280 HP (please just treat this as a stringent requirement as it is his personal preference). He would prefer mileage under 68K. Here are the requirements again:

Budget: $20K
Tranny: Manual preferred, but good auto ok
HP: 280+
Miles: Less than 68K
Concerns: Reliability is a high priority after recent audi experience.
Drivetrain: RWD, AWD preferred but FWD ok as well.

So far he is thinking about a 335i or 370Z. I would appreciate your help in guiding him.

Cheers.

First of all, I'm willing to bet that your buddy's "horrific" timing chain experience was a result of failure to do preventive maintenance. Newer Audi V8s (the ones that come with the timing chain) need to have chain tensioners adjusted/replaced around the 80K mark. It's a costly job, as the engine needs to be pulled (the timing chain is at the back) but if you don't do it, the tensioners are going to fail and the engine will self destruct. I bet your that you buddy, like many other B6/B7 S4 owners, never bothered with this and just drove the car until it died. If you are going to own a high mileage, high performance car (regardless of the brand), doing preventative maintenance is absolutely key. We are not talking about a Corolla with 100 hp engine here.

I also find some of the suggestions for a "reliable" high mileage sports car rather amusing. A high mileage 335i? Are you guys serious?? I've had the HPFP replaced twice, injectors (ALL of them) replaced three times and the car has only 35,000 miles on the clock. The N54 is by far the least reliable BMW engine since the disastrous nikasil-plated V8s in the 90s...I don't even want to imagine how much it would have cost me fixing these issues out of warranty. As for the guy who suggested the 996...do the words Intermediary Shaft and Rear Main Seal mean anything to you? STIs, Evos, 370Z, etc. all have their issues too.

The only car I can think of that really stands out from the rest in terms of reliability is the Corvette...mostly because it's based on ancient yet bulletproof technology. Pushrod V8, leaf spring suspension...but still a nice car to drive, not to mention the timeless looks.

[son_of_siggy]

Originally Posted by Ti335

I also find some of the suggestions for a "reliable" high mileage sports car rather amusing. A high mileage 335i? Are you guys serious?? I've had the HPFP replaced twice, injectors (ALL of them) replaced three times and the car has only 35,000 miles on the clock. The N54 is by far the least reliable BMW engine since the disastrous nikasil-plated V8s in the 90s...I don't even want to imagine how much it would have cost me fixing these issues out of warranty.

The fact remains that nearly everything that makes the 335i unreliable IS covered by a warranty . . . one that extends well past the car's factory warranty.

When I think of someone saying they want a "reliable" car, I envision their main motivating factor being the cost of maintenance and upkeep. If there is zero cost to replacing the unreliable factors in a car, it's not such a big deal. And for everyone out there that has had 335i issues, there are 10x as many people without. People blow their issues way out of proportion. We've owned a N54 335i since 2007, running FBO w/Meth, and to my memory hasn't had any injector issues. The HPFP was replaced by the dealer when the car was taken in for regular maintenance, not because it was failing, but just because a newer version had been released and the dealer was doing the right thing. 70k+ miles now, we just did our own walnut blasting of the valves, and the thing runs like a top.