[SFBavarianArea]

Originally Posted by ThesaVeliona

I love how half of the time we hate on it, but later on we say it looks alright. Will that be the case here as well?

Are u kidding…that’s the case with every reveal since Bangle. So much that I’m surprised no one’s made a meme of it yet 🙄

[The J-Man]

WTF. First 5-series ever that I don't want. Looks like last generation E-class from the back. WTF.

[[/:\] GP9000]

I5 eDrive40
M-Sport Tanzanite Blue with Merino Silverstone interior
.
Just configured it for the looks, coming out at 80k€, but still not feeling the design language.
Having said that I‘ll definitely take a closer look once it hits the showroom.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by [/:\] GP9000

I5 eDrive40
M-Sport Tanzanite Blue with Merino Silverstone interior
.
Just configured it for the looks, coming out at 80k€, but still not feeling the design language.
Having said that I‘ll definitely take a closer look once it hits the showroom.

If I were building a BMW from scratch right now, I think I’d go tanzanite

[[/:\] GP9000]

Originally Posted by NGT2

If I were building a BMW from scratch right now, I think I’d go tanzanite

My long-time favorite is Carbon Black, but TB is just

[OHV_44]

My confi:

520i M-Sport Package.
53,000 € + tax.





https://configure.bmw.de/de_DE/summa...figId=8zqck5km

[OHV_44]

With 21" and roof he looks better.

[KashunatoR]

It sucks that we can't even have the 530 ix in Europe, which is still a 4 cyl engine. We can't even dream of a 540 ix. This green agenda has gone out of control!
What if I just want a petrol engine with all wheel drive and I don't want to carry a battery that I don't plan to charge and which also eats into my trunk?

[AP]

Is it next year for the i6 I’m Europe or is it simply not going to the Eu market?

I know it’s just launched and not everything is available day 1 but the choice of power plants just doesn’t seem remotely comparable to the outgoing g30

[KashunatoR]

I'm pretty sure they're not coming to EU at all. 300 IQ strategy.

[AP]

Fro those that don’t want to or not able to go the i5 route, that’s going to turn off a lot of prospective buyers , those that traditionally bought a 530d or 540 or equivalent

[Deho]

Originally Posted by KashunatoR

It sucks that we can't even have the 530 ix in Europe, which is still a 4 cyl engine. We can't even dream of a 540 ix. This green agenda has gone out of control!
What if I just want a petrol engine with all wheel drive and I don't want to carry a battery that I don't plan to charge and which also eats into my trunk?

I know it's a sacrifice to make but sadly our atmosphere can only contain so much carbon before everything turns to shit. Humanity has a total carbon budget...

I know big engines can be more fun, but the EU is thinking about the long term, and that means some individual sacrifices to make to collectively protect ourselves. It's not an "agenda", it's just basic common sense if we want humanity to go on. You'll get plenty of choices with ICEs, PHEVs and EVs. Sucks to not get the one you want, but we're paying for decades of abuse.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by Deho

I know it's a sacrifice to make but sadly our atmosphere can only contain so much carbon before everything turns to shit. Humanity has a total carbon budget...

I know big engines can be more fun, but the EU is thinking about the long term, and that means some individual sacrifices to make to collectively protect ourselves. It's not an "agenda", it's just basic common sense if we want humanity to go on. You'll get plenty of choices with ICEs, PHEVs and EVs. Sucks to not get the one you want, but we're paying for decades of abuse.

The carbon budget might be real, but the idea that the changes being made to vehicles has any impact is a total sham. That’s why I don’t believe anything these people say. They prove to be untrustworthy when they take a real problem and then use it as an excuse to push an agenda that doesn’t do anything for the problem.

Allowing the B58 engine to thrive in Europe isn’t hurting the environment at all. Talk to China and India about their industrial activity. Start with something that makes a difference.

This says it nicely

[Deho]

Originally Posted by NGT2

The carbon budget might be real, but the idea that the changes being made to vehicles has any impact is a total sham. That’s why I don’t believe anything these people say. They prove to be untrustworthy when they take a real problem and then use it as an excuse to push an agenda that doesn’t do anything for the problem.

Allowing the B58 engine to thrive in Europe isn’t hurting the environment at all. Talk to China and India about their industrial activity. Start with something that makes a difference.

This says it nicely

It's an interesting debate.

Of course, if you *only* consider the B58 engine, it doesn't make a great difference; depriving the EU consumer of the 540i, for example, and offering the 520i as the only ICE model, won't save the planet. Nobody thinks that. And that's the biggest problem with the environmental crisis; we don't do what we should do because for individuals we perceive great sacrifices for almost no perceptible effect.

However, by getting rid of the B58 in the EU (for example), we make a small choice among millions of other small choices that WILL make a difference. If this debate about the engines of BMWs was the only one, it would be laughable. But this small debate we have here is in the context of millions of other small debates about the way we live. Transport is a huge contributor to pollution and climate change, but so are food, housing, waste management, urban planning etc. We can't ignore any of these factors.

Now, you are also comparing this choice to ones made in China and India. As you said, they also will have to change their ways. But we will have no impact if we don't do our part. And unfortunately the West has been damaging the environnement for decades and got rich by doing so, so we have a responsibility to start first. If mankind exceeds its carbon budget, it will be mostly because of us. Also, we pollute WAY MORE per individual in the West still; China and India pollute way less per person.

So we have a responsibility that is very important. If we don't make these sacrifices, I guarantee no one will.

I for one am happy that BMW is going full EV, but still would prefer them to be even more aggressive and make sure to reduce to a minimum pollution in their whole supply chain (making EV batteries is a big source of pollution, even if it is the lesser of two evils). I welcome their i Vision Circular, which is promising.

We really don't have a choice. We have to stop spending more ressources than the earth generates.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by Deho

It's an interesting debate.

Of course, if you *only* consider the B58 engine, it doesn't make a great difference; depriving the EU consumer of the 540i, for example, and offering the 520i as the only ICE model, won't save the planet. Nobody thinks that. And that's the biggest problem with the environmental crisis; we don't do what we should do because for individuals we perceive great sacrifices for almost no perceptible effect.

However, by getting rid of the B58 in the EU (for example), we make a small choice among millions of other small choices that WILL make a difference. If this debate about the engines of BMWs was the only one, it would be laughable. But this small debate we have here is in the context of millions of other small debates about the way we live. Transport is a huge contributor to pollution and climate change, but so are food, housing, waste management, urban planning etc. We can't ignore any of these factors.

Now, you are also comparing this choice to ones made in China and India. As you said, they also will have to change their ways. But we will have no impact if we don't do our part. And unfortunately the West has been damaging the environnement for decades and got rich by doing so, so we have a responsibility to start first. If mankind exceeds its carbon budget, it will be mostly because of us. Also, we pollute WAY MORE per individual in the West still; China and India pollute way less per person.

So we have a responsibility that is very important. If we don't make these sacrifices, I guarantee no one will.

I for one am [...]

Going full EV doesn’t really have any net benefit. We just burn up the resources building the cars instead of running the cars. Everything you said sounds pretty in theory. Something either solves the problem or doesn’t. Individual choice shouldn’t be sacrificed in the name of symbolic gestures. Also, the world literally is not ready for full EV.

I understand chasing efficiency. But let’s actually do that. PHEV is a great current step. The over aggression toward full EV is only serving to line pockets.

And the idea that China and India will follow the lead is wild to me. Why would they?

[Deho]

Originally Posted by NGT2

Going full EV doesn’t really have any net benefit. We just burn up the resources building the cars instead of running the cars.

I understand chasing efficiency. But let’s actually do that. PHEV is a great current step. The over aggression toward full EV is only serving to line pockets.

And the idea that China and India will follow the lead is wild to me. Why would they?

You say that going full EV doesn't have any net benefit but data suggests otherwise: https://www.iea.org/data-and-statist...nd-ice-vehicle. I could also share many other sources that demonstrate that EVs have a global footprint that is much less than their equivalent ICE vehicule, even when said EV is powered by electricity generated by fossil fuels.

As for PHEVs, I agree with you. When used as they should be (frequent recharges), they are a better solution than BEVs for anyone that mostly commutes and only do a few longer trips every year. A huge battery in a car that mostly stays parked is wasteful, even if better than a ICE car. The future is car sharing, so that BEVs do what they should to be most effective: rolling a lot.

As for China and India, they will have to make the same changes as us no matter what. The question is only when. And if we wait and wait and wait in the West, we only encourage them to do the same.

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by Deho

You say that going full EV doesn't have any net benefit but data suggests otherwise: https://www.iea.org/data-and-statist...d-ice-vehicle. I could also share many other sources that demonstrate that EVs have a global footprint that is much less than their equivalent ICE vehicule, even when said EV is powered by electricity generated by fossil fuels.

As for PHEVs, I agree with you. When used as they should be (frequent recharges), they are a better solution than BEVs for anyone that mostly commutes and only do a few longer trips every year. A huge battery in a car that mostly stays parked is wasteful, even if better than a ICE car. The future is car sharing, so that BEVs do what they should to be most effective: rolling a lot.

As for China and India, they will have to make the same changes as us no matter what. The question is only when. And if we wait and wait and wait in the West, we only encourage them to do the same.

I don’t think you’re going to sell car sharing in America. And China and India just don’t care. I seriously doubt it matters what we do.

Regardless, industrial activity is a bigger deal than what car you and I drive.

If people want to drive electric cars, I think it’s great. I’m not against their existence. I just don’t think they sold anything. It’s all politics and profit.

[BMW012]

every brand is going after tesla, as they are losing market share. car brands are there to make money, not to save the environment at the end of the day (some do care more and try more, additionally due to government regulations).

[NGT2]

Originally Posted by BMW012

every brand is going after tesla, as they are losing market share. car brands are there to make money, not to save the environment at the end of the day (some do care more and try more, additionally due to government regulations).

Yeah I think more in regards to regulation. It wouldn’t be moving this fast without the regs. If there were no regs, there would be less elimination of existing powertrains. V8’s maybe, but not ICE as a whole.

[Sisyrx]

Originally Posted by rogercheng3

US configurator goes live on 6/20

Where's my US configurator??

[Eric500]

Originally Posted by Sisyrx

Where's my US configurator??

At least it’s better than MB. They have cars already for sale with no configurator

[arkhi]

Originally Posted by Sisyrx

Where's my US configurator??

Should be up June 27.