[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by shivaswrath

Standard lights in 335i are bi xenon.

Those did not look like bi xenon on the test pics. They looked like yellow halogens standard on the 328i e9x series. Is the new F series 3s considerably worse than the e9x series? Maybe I'm mixing up my beams. I mean HID. I have the adaptive HID lights on my 335i.

[switchman]

Everybody who owns a bimmer with halogen lights agree it is insufficient lighting and beamed so low. Even older bmw's are same as i had difficulty seeing the road in my '03 e39.
I've tried different bulbs and just went back to silverstar ultra and adjusted low beams. If anyone wants to adjust, i suggest not going more than 5 clicks (adjuster screw have detents)to the right to gain approximately 250 ft. low beam focus. i can see road better now.

[baje]

I recently ordered a new 228i without the lighting package, and the car is now in transit to the West coast. When I called the dealer and asked about the headlight issue, I was told higher discharge bulbs can be installed for $185.00, which are supposed to extend the beam and are "almost as good as the xenons". He said they know about the problem and that's why they keep the bulbs in stock! l'm not buying a new car that has crappy headlights that I have to pay extra to be almost as good as the marginally rated xenons. Maybe they should have mentioned this to me when I was placing the order? The dealer is waffling on whether the deposit will be refunded.I am going to the dealer today to cancel my order for this car. Dependent on the dealer response I will either walk away or start over with a new build which will include xenons. This is disappointing for my first BMW purchase experience.

[zx10guy]

I just don't understand why BMW doesn't change their factory specs to resolve the aim of the low beams. Based on what I'm seeing in this thread, it's a common problem for those that actually care about seeing well at distance at night. Unfortunately, the US is full of drivers which shouldn't be driving in the first place and these people don't care.

[pruettfan]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

I just don't understand why BMW doesn't change their factory specs to resolve the aim of the low beams. Based on what I'm seeing in this thread, it's a common problem for those that actually care about seeing well at distance at night. Unfortunately, the US is full of drivers which shouldn't be driving in the first place and these people don't care.

Really important to understand two factors here. NHTSA has been obsessed with concerns of oncoming drivers being blinded so they have encouraged or forced manufactures to reduce the brightness and change the aim of the lights, there are several documented cases where they have refused to allow Euro spec to come to the USA. Also this is the first time that a test like this has been done, just like everything else the insurance institute does they move the bar so we absolutely will see all of the manufactures respond to this because they don't want their cars to have marginal ratings for insurance in any area. Bob Lutz has spoken to this point in articles in the past. He said the insurance institute shapes car design far more than consumers will ever know. The good news is we will see better in the coming years as headlights improve.

[mc3456]

My F80 with Euro coded LEDs are excellent. If the U.S. stop restricting innovation, automobile lighting will advance rapidly.

[pruettfan]

Originally Posted by baje

I recently ordered a new 228i without the lighting package, and the car is now in transit to the West coast. When I called the dealer and asked about the headlight issue, I was told higher discharge bulbs can be installed for $185.00, which are supposed to extend the beam and are "almost as good as the xenons". He said they know about the problem and that's why they keep the bulbs in stock! l'm not buying a new car that has crappy headlights that I have to pay extra to be almost as good as the marginally rated xenons. Maybe they should have mentioned this to me when I was placing the order? The dealer is waffling on whether the deposit will be refunded.I am going to the dealer today to cancel my order for this car. Dependent on the dealer response I will either walk away or start over with a new build which will include xenons. This is disappointing for my first BMW purchase experience.

Almost every car made has marginal lights according to this new standard. Unless you plan on buying a Prius with the tech package pretty much any car you buy is going to have headlights that don't perform well enough for this test. It is a new standard. I would take the car, adjust the headlights and put in Piaa bulbs to get the best performance you can and leave it at that. If this test never came out you would probably be happy enough with the car so I wouldn't let this change your opinion if I were you.

[Chez]

Originally Posted by baje

I recently ordered a new 228i without the lighting package, and the car is now in transit to the West coast. When I called the dealer and asked about the headlight issue, I was told higher discharge bulbs can be installed for $185.00, which are supposed to extend the beam and are "almost as good as the xenons". He said they know about the problem and that's why they keep the bulbs in stock! l'm not buying a new car that has crappy headlights that I have to pay extra to be almost as good as the marginally rated xenons. Maybe they should have mentioned this to me when I was placing the order? The dealer is waffling on whether the deposit will be refunded.I am going to the dealer today to cancel my order for this car. Dependent on the dealer response I will either walk away or start over with a new build which will include xenons. This is disappointing for my first BMW purchase experience.

They should just give you a complimentary upgrade to an M4 GTS.

[subrven1]

It's not that all Halogens are bad, the Base Honda Accord Halogen headlights got Acceptable ratings. It's how these halogens are designed. The 3 series ones are really bad

Originally Posted by Ghetto2315

It's an absolute crime that HID Bi-Xenon headlights are not standard equipment on EVERY model. There are things that I marvel at with BMW and what they do to transcend the automotive market. Having halogen headlights still is on the complete opposite end of the spectrum. Embarrassing.

[taibanl]

Originally Posted by pruettfan

Really important to understand two factors here. NHTSA has been obsessed with concerns of oncoming drivers being blinded so they have encouraged or forced manufactures to reduce the brightness and change the aim of the lights, there are several documented cases where they have refused to allow Euro spec to come to the USA. Also this is the first time that a test like this has been done, just like everything else the insurance institute does they move the bar so we absolutely will see all of the manufactures respond to this because they don't want their cars to have marginal ratings for insurance in any area. Bob Lutz has spoken to this point in articles in the past. He said the insurance institute shapes car design far more than consumers will ever know. The good news is we will see better in the coming years as headlights improve.

The blinding problem seems to get worse ans worse every week. I literally have to pull over sometimes on some narrow rods when facing oncoming traffic

[BMWrules7]

Originally Posted by AIRPOWER

I don't know about all this stuff....but I do know that my LEDs are bright and white as hell and people flash me all the time. I see better with these headlights than with any other car I have owned.

My wife's car is a XC60 with bi-xenon and when I drive her car now, I say why are these headlights so dim and yellow.

I support BMW and I am loyal. But, my 2013 X1's stock headlights are awful.

I brought this on myself as I wanted a stripped down X1 for my wife as she refused any options saying she didn't want it.

But, I am trusting BMW that even in its base config that my car will perform like a BMW. And that means a baseline of safety.

BMW should have killed off its stock lights years ago. But, if they do that then they can't tout the performance of xenon or LED to be X times better.

BMW should offer to retro all stock underperforming headlights built and sold during the past 5 years.

I mean, it's the headlights people.

[Em135eye]

LEDs/xenons STILL aren't standard here on the 335d; that's a £45k car. My old one (E91) didn't have them either.
Luckily the M135i has them as standard.
For bad lights try a LR Defender; you're better off holding a lit match up to show the way. The only vehicle in which I upgraded the lights.

[adc]

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

BMW has had issues aiming their lights for awhile now. This is nothing new. The Xenons on the e9x were aimed way too low.

This.

I've had to adjust them on every single BMW I've had so far. Rule of thumb, give it 3 turns (unscrew motion) on each knob, see how you like it.

If you need to go more than 5-6 turns you should take it to a shop because your left/right headlights may no longer be correctly aligned to "meet" at a distance.

[3GFX]

The BMW Group ... we remain confident that we offer our customers very effective headlight systems at a variety of price points.

Also known as "you get what you pay for".

[bradleyland]

So much misinformation in this thread it's making my head spin. They tested way more than the halogens. The AutoBlog article just sucks. You're far better off checking out the IIHS results directly.

They tested two models with several different headlight configs:

2-Series
- HID
- Halogen

3-Series
- LED
- Halogen

They tested with and without adaptive and high-beam-assist, where available. You can see detailed test results on the respective vehicle test pages; just click on "headlights" in the menu.

BMW 2-Series
BMW 3-Series
Toyota Prius (best in test)

There are some great charts on that site that show the performance of the headlights. You can see that the BMW really only falls short because of its low-beam performance. As most have noted, that is an adjustment issue. For example, here's the 3-Series halogen, 3-Series LED adaptive, and Prius LED:

3-Series halogen


3-Series LED adaptive


Prius LED

[CanadianGatorBacon]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

So much misinformation in this thread it's making my head spin.

Thank you. I'd given up the fight trying to get people to focus on more than just the halogens, but I wasn't motivated enough to get the charts into the post. After all of my previous attempts, I was pretty convinced it wouldn't make a difference anyway since people seemed to not pay attention to the details anyway.

The autoblog article isn't that great when it comes down to the details, and they mostly got it from a blurb on the IIHS site, but it does mention that there were different bad scores for the more premium headlight options for the 3er. Either people didn't care to address that and just wanted to get on a soapbox, or failed at reading.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by CanadianGatorBacon

Admin Update: directly below is BMWUSA's official response to the IIHS report:




Original post:

"Many of the poorest-scoring vehicles were luxury cars. Case in point: The headlights on the BMW 3-Series [with halogen lights] received the lowest marks of any car tested. Researchers said a driver with a BMW equipped with those headlines would have to be going 35 miles per hour or slower to stop in time to avoid an obstacle in the travel lane."

"A better-performing headlight system available on the 3-Series [i.e., LED lights], for example, earned a "marginal" score."

"Cars earning a "marginal" rating include: the Acura TLX, Ford Fusion, Audi A4, Lincoln MKZ, BMW 2-series, BMW 3-Series, Subaru Legacy, Toyota Camry and Chrysler 200."

http://www.autoblog.com/2016/03/30/h...afety-car-led/

"Headlights are evaluated on the track after dark at the IIHS Vehicle Research Center. A special device measures the light from both low beams and high beams as the vehicle is driven on five different approaches: traveling straight, a sharp left curve, a sharp right curve, a gradual left curve and a gradual right curve.

Glare for oncoming vehicles also is measured from low beams in each scenario to make sure it isn't excessive.

Headlights are tested as received from the dealer. Although the vertical aim of headlights can be adjusted on most vehicles, IIHS doesn't change headlight aim because few vehicle owners ever do and some manufacturers advise consumers not to.

After a vehicle is tested on the track, IIHS engineers compare its visibility and glare measurements to those of a hypothetical ideal headlight system and use a scheme of demerits to determine the rating. Results for low beams are weighted more heavily than high beams because they are used more often. The readings on the straightaway are weighted more heavily than those on the curves because more crashes occur on straight sections of road.

Vehicles equipped with high-beam assist, which automatically switches between high beams and low beams depending on the presence of other vehicles, may earn back some points taken off for less-than-ideal low beam visibility. This credit is given only for approaches on which the glare threshold isn't exceeded and on which the high beams provide additional visibility compared with the low beams.

A vehicle with excessive glare on any of the approaches can't earn a rating above marginal."

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/news/deskto...ed-improvement

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/ratings/rat...ght-evaluation


Prius V LED vs BMW 3er halogen:

Attachment 1392541

Attachment 1392542

I also don't know much but I replaced the HID headlights in my 2003 330i a couple of years ago with new units since the reflectors went out. They are awesome and ironically better than the the fancy 1M swiveling headlights in my 1M. So are the wife's GTI. I'm not sure what is going on but definitely was wondering about the headlights lately. This graphic really helps explain it and it is exactly like my 330i and 1M. The 330 is like the Prius and the other one is like the 1M. Maybe they should spend less effort on the angel eyes and swiveling and just make lights better?

Sad that a Prius that is slower lights the road better.

[CanadianGatorBacon]

Add the X1 to the list of marginal scores:

[oonowindoo]

Did it say what kind of light on the Acceptable ones?

I know CR-V only has projectors on the Touring trim and all others have reflectors. CX-3 has Halogen and HID..

[Z K]

Originally Posted by baje

I recently ordered a new 228i without the lighting package, and the car is now in transit to the West coast. When I called the dealer and asked about the headlight issue, I was told higher discharge bulbs can be installed for $185.00, which are supposed to extend the beam and are "almost as good as the xenons". He said they know about the problem and that's why they keep the bulbs in stock! l'm not buying a new car that has crappy headlights that I have to pay extra to be almost as good as the marginally rated xenons. Maybe they should have mentioned this to me when I was placing the order? The dealer is waffling on whether the deposit will be refunded.I am going to the dealer today to cancel my order for this car. Dependent on the dealer response I will either walk away or start over with a new build which will include xenons. This is disappointing for my first BMW purchase experience.

That sounds terrible. I'd avoid whatever the dealer will install.

It sounds like they are just going to put in some replacement bulbs for you in the stock halogen housing. That's something you can easily do yourself for much less. The actual improvement in lighting would be minimal as well. Just the dealer trying to rip you off by "upgrading" your headlights with some "xenon" colored bulbs.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by oonowindoo

Did it say what kind of light on the Acceptable ones?

I know CR-V only has projectors on the Touring trim and all others have reflectors. CX-3 has Halogen and HID..

If you scroll to the bottom of this page, you can find links to all the individual tests:

http://www.iihs.org/iihs/news/deskto...hs-evaluations

Vehicle: High Beam/Low Beam
Ford Escape: HID/HID
Honda CR-V: Halogen/Halogen
Hyundai Tuscson: LED/Halogen
Mazda CX-3: LED projector/LED reflector

Keep in mind that they way they rate these headlights is very complex. It's not a simple matter of "LED > HID > halogen". They factor in illumination from multiple angles, as well as glare.

[oonowindoo]

Thank you.

I care more about low beam performance since i rarely use my LED high beam.
If that comparison graphic on top is actually accurate... Holy shit... you can almost see twice as far in a Prius than my LED. Not that i am going to get a Prius but it would be nice if i can see a little further at night, especially the driver side.