[deutsch100]

Originally Posted by Ossian

One other related point - the ventilated seats in my G30 were so useless that I almost never turned them on - it felt like they just blew warm air. The M60 ventilated seats feel cooled and are a noticeable relief on hot days. I had what was probably the first 530e to land in the US, so maybe they fixed this in later MY's but man was cabin cooling of all types bad in my G30....

My i5 M60 had the best ventilated seats in any BMW I have ever had. They actually did almost feel cooled like Jaguar-Land Rover and Ford-Lincoln.

Ventilated seats in the iX and i7....average at best! How can they be so great in the new i5 and not great in the iX and i7?

When I had my i5 M60, I actually had to turn the vented seats down or off after a few mins, as I felt chilled (and I run very hot usually).

[magbarn]

Originally Posted by Ossian

One other related point - the ventilated seats in my G30 were so useless that I almost never turned them on - it felt like they just blew warm air. The M60 ventilated seats feel cooled and are a noticeable relief on hot days. I had what was probably the first 530e to land in the US, so maybe they fixed this in later MY's but man was cabin cooling of all types bad in my G30....

Nah, they never fixed them. All G30 vented seats are trash. Glad to hear that the G60 fixes that. I did a Turo recently on an IS500 and the ventilated seats on that were awesome compared to the G30.

[Ossian]

Originally Posted by magbarn

Nah, they never fixed them. All G30 vented seats are trash. Glad to hear that the G60 fixes that. I did a Turo recently on an IS500 and the ventilated seats on that were awesome compared to the G30.

Yeah, that was another annoying factor -- we had an old Lexus RX at the same time and the seats in that thing felt fully air conditioned. I'm not sure what BMW is doing different now, but it is definitely cool air being blown.

[jha96]

Originally Posted by BimmerLCI

Checkout my nightdrive video on the G60 530i. The interior is quite mundane with little to desire. I’m really concerned with bmw and it’s cheap plastic interior on surfaces that should be leather such as the steering airbag, dash board, door cards etc. lack of ambient lighting compare to the G30, this new 5er is such a disappointment. For contrast my highly spec X3 G01 has nicely finished window switches almost feeling like aluminum, everything you feel and touch is weighted and feels like BMW quality. On this G60 everything is lightweight and plastic no tactile feel. What irks me the most is the comfort access. Again a 23 X3 LCI has 4 door comfort access, the G60 5er only has it on the front door. Some really good options were the driver assist professional and parking assistance, really good features worked great, camera quality is so crisp you can see cracks in the road through the front or rear camera. Again this is a 530i basic spec but it’s such a lazy attempt at a 5er level bmw

For what it's worth, I really like my G60 and my last BMW was a 2021 M8 GC Competition.

[nick380]

Originally Posted by Scrapula

You can set favorites. Just press and hold add to favorites. Swipe down from the top of the screen and all your favorites are there. I also set a gesture for things I use often. For example, I point 2 fingers to bring up parking, so I can use the cameras.

As for organization, you can press vehicle or infotainment to narrow down what is on the screen. Once you are done setting your initial drive preferences, you will rarely need to go into vehicle settings. You will rarely use the infotainment as well, unless you are parked and want to watch videos. The musical note brings up all your music choices. Once you set the few things that you need as favorites, you won’t ever need to scroll through iDrive.

Fair. The ease of that function and the delivery of it is lackluster at best. Given it's a simple press and hold of the quick select buttons BMW has had for over a decade now. I will have to check if mine has the gesture control, as I use it daily in my F90. I don't even have to touch anything for that, which is nice. This is showing again, trying to reinvent something that never needed reinventing all for the sake of "modernization". They don't cater to their audience anymore, and it shows. There is a different demographic targeted now. Look at Mercedes and the EQS and how that turned out.

I know of the selecting vehicle settings, etc. It's not about that. It's the fact everything is now based on this display, if the display has any issues you are out of luck for what is 90% of the cars interior features. This is not the case with the prior generation. I would agree, you definitely could get used to it, but does that in the end make it okay? Does it make it a great design? An improvement over the last generation? I would argue no. Because it is lazy, it's not original, and looking back at how BMW pioneered the ID system. Sad.

And we're only talking purely the ID8.5 system. The car itself leaves a lot to be desired.

[Neusser]

Originally Posted by PsychDoc

There may be mixed opinions on the overall looks of the G60 and the interior appointments but as a vehicle it's supremely smooth and powerful (540xi) and is infinitely superior to the outgoing G30 in its driving dynamics and overall refinement.

It sits higher and is heavier. Inherent dynamics cannot be better by definition.

The G30/31 has top-shelf dynamics, unless you take the M550, which is an understeery pig with Audi-like weight on the nose in the heavier configs.

The G60 is a compromised platform, but set up stiffer to help hide it.

[PeterC4]

Originally Posted by OHV_44

I think you need to keep driving your X3.

1. No more sunroof in Germany
2. No rear window opening (G61)
3. No massage seats
4. No more 17-inchers
5. Fewer buttons
6. Goodbye, shifter
7. Ventilation through the joint
8. No more door sills
9. Decorative strips end at the beginning of the doors at the front --> they are completely missing at the back
10. No ambient lighting (LED strips) at the back
11. Cup holder open at the back in the middle rest, the mechanism for opening and closing is missing.
12. The cheap version of the cargo area cover can only be pushed. (G61)
13. No more favorite buttons
14. No independent 5 Series cockpit, no dashboard but only the touch board
15. No halfway decent dashboard display on the touch board
16. The backs of the seats are now completely modeled on a hard-shell suitcase
17. Comfort seats with missing adjustments (top backrest no longer adjustable).
18. No more keyless sensors on the rear doors.
19. No more knee airbag.
20. No more Alcantara headliner.
21. No more exclusive leather package / full leather package.

Adding

22. No real exhaust ports in the rear.
23. No more ambient air.
24. ARS (Active Roll Stabilization) not available even with all wheel steering?
25. No functioning sunroof with premium package, just a glass roof.
26. No more soft close doors.
27. Uni-colour (black) side skirts regardless of colour.
28. Bowers and Wilkins Stereo is equivalent to the HK in the G30.


I may have missed some. Hard to ignore the cost cutting that has been undertaken. It's a shame. Certainly a step back from the G30. Looks like management has made some obvious decisions in an attempt to defray the costs of electrification.

[COBodom]

I cannot resist... this thread is getting ridiculous.

Half of this bitching and moaning about G60 is petty, subjective often made up $hit (BW in G60 is better than HK in G30). Some options people couldn't care less about be it in G30 or in G60 (ambient air).

Yes, I am the first to say, it's true the car has cheaper interior than G30. Yes, it's also true options are fewer, perhaps that's a sign of re-positioning the 5 series down the market ladder (vs the X5).

HOWEVER, my 540 G60 can still run circles around my prior two 540 G30s when it comes to ride comfort, driving position, dynamics, etc.

Yes, please tell me how G60 is much heavier, bigger, uglier and bla bla bla lol...

[scas12]

It's interesting to compare the g60 to prior generations, but does it matter? If you want a new car like the 5 series, you can only compare to other new cars. I wanted a 5 series type car, all electric, and with great performance. For me the i5 M60 was the best blend of vehicle dynamics, tech, luxury, and fit and finish. If the G30 were still there without an all electric powertrain it would not have been an option.

[SkykingUSA]

Originally Posted by PeterC4

Adding

22. No real exhaust ports in the rear.
23. No more ambient air.
24. ARS (Active Roll Stabilization) not available even with all wheel steering?
25. No functioning sunroof with premium package, just a glass roof.
26. No more soft close doors.
27. Uni-colour (black) side skirts regardless of colour.
28. Bowers and Wilkins Stereo is equivalent to the HK in the G30.


I may have missed some. Hard to ignore the cost cutting that has been undertaken. It's a shame. Certainly a step back from the G30. Looks like management has made some obvious decisions in an attempt to defray the costs of electrification.

My point here does not really detract from the overall point you're making in the big picture, it's more a point of clarification about just one bullet. Regarding your # 25: maybe you don't get that in Canada cars because there are differences between markets as we all know, but in the US, the premium package comes with a functioning sunroof. That's what I have on my car, and it has the premium package.

[AiredaleDad]

For me, since I have not owned a BMW since 2011, I find the G60 very refined. No more dealing with buttons that eventually turn gummy (As in my Mercedes and my Range Rover), no more Air conditioner ports to collect dust, Functional personal assistant, Functional self parking, and self driving, comfortable seats (Luxury seating package) Exhaust ports I wish they had an option, (and I will modify mine when I can). Superior handling and acceleration (Thanks to the B58) to anything I have driven before except for a race car. As to soft close doors, I learned as a child not to slam doors, so I don't have an issue with that. Black side skirts look really good with my MSport Pro package. I could go on. but will people quit trying to compare the G60 to the G30. After all, what did people say when the G30 replaced the F10? I bet there was similar complaining. I have said it before, if you don't like it, don't buy it. But quit slamming it. Are you hoping you are going to convince people to not get it as some sort of protest against BMW? Sorry, but not going to happen.

I could have said the LR3 I owned was not as good off road as the Discovery I had before it. They were different. Totally new approaches. And when the LR4 led to the new Discovery it was all chaos. I didn't like it and moved up to a Range Rover Sport. But people still buy the Discovery. I didn't go on a forum and trash the Discovery. I just found something I liked better. Don't like the G60, fine, go buy something you do like.

[ToddRGuy]

I'm surprised to see this thread return, like another season of the Walking Dead.

Okay, Listen, I get it. People aren't happy with things related to the G60, but at this point, as the second production year arrives, with many more yet to come, I see only a few paths forward when looking at these gripes.

In looking at this laundry list of items, I'd break it down into three basic categories.

Design Aesthetics: 2,4,6,7,9,10,12,13,14,15,16,22,23,25,27
Interior Appointments & Options: 1,3,11,17,18,20,21,26,28
Mechanical: 19,24

As far as design aesthetics are concerned, the choices are to "Get over it" and then select one of the following options:

• Keep your existing BMW forever and be happy with it.
• Buy a G60 Anyway and complain about it.
• Buy a G60 and embrace the change.
• Buy a different BMW
• Buy a different Brand

Regarding the interior appointments and options
As a new arrival to BMW I would agree with the following: 3,8, 11,18 and 26. With the most seriously detracting ones for the price of the car being 8, 11, and 18, from me, as a new brand initiate.

The others, massaging seats, the air fresheners, the soft close doors, etc. Again, how many people ordered it vs. how much it cost them to offer them on the production line. I'm sure a significant amount of research went into this and the answer clearly boiled down to "not enough to warrant the cost."

Mechanical

Knee Airbags: It still got excellent crash ratings, with excellent ratings for knee and femur protection without them. Many crash analysis studies in the last 3-4 years have shown knee airbags have little value. In fact, in small overlap crash testing, they were shown to increase the risk of right femur and right lower leg injuries. I'm sure significant analysis went into the decision.

ARS Systems: Was it needed? Given the size of the vehicle, did the cost and complexity of the system improve its slalom time? Would it be noticeable more dynamic? Is it significant enough that the majority of their target audience are going to notice? to care? How much did it cost them on the G30 to offer it vs. how many people ordered it?

All this being said, I am perplexed about why people just don't move on. Listen, I have an Audi A5 Sportback. Loved it when I got it. It's been a wonderful car, and I have nothing bad to say about it at all. I didn't like the painful periods of time between redesigns with Audi. Not changing the vehicle design after 8 years is ridiculous. The lack of significant improvement to technology is unacceptable. And, I moved on. Hello BMW.

[PeterC4]

Originally Posted by SkykingUSA

My point here does not really detract from the overall point you're making in the big picture, it's more a point of clarification about just one bullet. Regarding your # 25: maybe you don't get that in Canada cars because there are differences between markets as we all know, but in the US, the premium package comes with a functioning sunroof. That's what I have on my car, and it has the premium package.

The car comes with a Panoramic glass roof that doesn't open, when you order the Premium Enhanced package. It does have a functioning sunroof in lesser guise. The Premium Enhanced package has some nice features so you have to accept a fixed roof.

[PeterC4]

Originally Posted by ToddRGuy

I'm surprised to see this thread return, like another season of the Walking Dead.

All this being said, I am perplexed about why people just don't move on.

Here is the explanation.

These changes were not evident early on. Some long-term BMW owners have ordered cars without even seeing them as leases expired, with an expectation that the cars would be built consistent with a standard they have been accustomed to. The 5 series has been significantly delayed in our markets and no one has really seen specific models or driven a 550e for example. But there are good faith orders collected by dealers significantly in advance of production. Now buyers are finding out, the cars are not what they expected. That is the issue. The ordering guide only tells you so much.

[PeterC4]

Originally Posted by AiredaleDad

For me, since I have not owned a BMW since 2011, I find the G60 very refined. I have said it before, if you don't like it, don't buy it. But quit slamming it. Are you hoping you are going to convince people to not get it as some sort of protest against BMW? Sorry, but not going to happen.
.

It's not the point. The G60, at least the 550e, M5, has been significantly delayed in our markets and it looks like the 540 is not going to make here at all. Secondly, there is nothing to see or compare to when ordering the cars and many Long-term BMW owners are ordering on an expectation of quality and features they have been accustomed to. The issue is related to information on how the cars are compared to the previous model. BMW's cost cutting measure introduced in 2021 (to cut costs by 25% in 2025) has manifested itself in a lot of different ways. At least readers who have history can compare. Mercedes has clearly taken a different path. Some owners taking delivery are going to find a lot of differences from the previous model.

[ToddRGuy]

Originally Posted by PeterC4

Here is the explanation.

These changes were not evident early on. Some long-term BMW owners have ordered cars without even seeing them as leases expired, with an expectation that the cars would be built consistent with a standard they have been accustomed to. The 5 series has been significantly delayed in our markets and no one has really seen specific models or driven a 550e for example. But there are good faith orders collected by dealers significantly in advance of production. Now buyers are finding out, the cars are not what they expected. That is the issue. The ordering guide only tells you so much.

That’s unfortunate to be certain. I can understand ordering one without seeing a specific model, but I’m surprised someone would order one without seeing at least an example of the Generation. It’s very unlikely that something significant would change from, for example, a 520 G60 to the 550, as far as interior build and trim. Subtle changes, of course, but not drastic ones between models within the same generation. Having those kinds of expectations don’t align with the historical reality of automotive design.

People can surely complain about the interior build quality but really there’s not a lot of defense for complaining about specific features, as these are readily listed on specification sheets. They also should not be surprised about the lack of a dash, the lack of a shifter, and things that are very much present in any of the thousands of media outlets that reported on the vehicle at launch.

What we’re witnessing is a global age of cost cutting. BMW, Mercedes and Audi are all doing a big experiment to see how much they can change before consumers jump brands. They’re also experimenting with new materials to support design changes and they’re not always being successful it seems.

I would sgeee that Mercedes has significantly more options than BMW, on its E class, however, between the two in 6 cylinder format, the handling and performance differences remain razor thin.

When fully optioned the way I’d purchase it, here in the U.S. the E class in 6 cylinder format came in at around $88,000. The 540 series was around $80k and with negation I secured it for $73500, with every option except leather seating. I didn’t like the color choices or I would have gotten those too.

After price it ultimately boiled down to a reliability comparison for me, and let’s face it Mercedes is abysmal. If I was leasing it, it wouldn’t be a consideration, but I am buying the 540 and thus that matters to me.

Perhaps, other people who are leasing G30’s will simply go with Mercedes next time?

[PeterC4]

Originally Posted by ToddRGuy

Perhaps, other people who are leasing G30’s will simply go with Mercedes next time?

It may happen when the BMWs finally show up and buyers have to decide whether to take delivery.

As to options and bundled options, there are some things that are not specifically disclosed or on the spec sheet until you see it. Given the delay in deliveries and real life testing, BMW buyers are finding things out from forums like this and elsewhere - after they have ordered cars. If BMW has accomplished its goal of taking out 25% of its costs over 4 years, there could be a lot more than meets the eye. As a result, long-term customers are experiencing a quality erosion.

[LegGodt2024]

I have a fully optioned i5 e40 Touring. I am still every day blown away by the luxury, the comfort, the looks and the drive.

My previous 3 cars before this were the audi etron fully loaded, the volvo xc90 t8 and the audo a6 (bit more basic). I love this bmw. But then of course I do. Why would i otherwise get one?

[AlteBMW]

Originally Posted by LegGodt2024

I have a fully optioned i5 e40 Touring. I am still every day blown away by the luxury, the comfort, the looks and the drive.

My previous 3 cars before this were the audi etron fully loaded, the volvo xc90 t8 and the audo a6 (bit more basic). I love this bmw. But then of course I do. Why would i otherwise get one?

And my wife loves her new 530ix and does not miss her MB E wagon one bit. She loves the looks, the ergonomics (electronics far superior to her MB) and the way it handles and the BW sound system. It is well optioned and it doesn't seem cheap. Its an absolutely fine car for her suburban driving.

I just had a base X1 as a loaner; I wouldn't buy that car but I didn't go on the X1 forum to tell everyone what was wrong with it.

[VicWip]

Lifes a trip.. really! My G60 ('24 540i) has been the missing piece in my life, for real! I'm still thinking about it constantly even though the "new" rubbed off last summer. I still read forums like this and everything! Lol! And what a load of horsesht some of it is... I traded in a G30 ('23 540i) when it got up past 120° last summer and dark graphite was no longer sustainable as a color. I got a "new" one that had sat around LA, on different lots, for six months. My new car smell was more like a new car whiff. It seems nobody wants a gas sedan with an "unacceptable" color.
Their loss, my gain! This car has blown me AWAY like no other before it! I loved my G30 but the engine was TOO much for rear wheel drive and it skipped around corners when floored (DEALBREAKER). BMW fixed that by making idrive standard in '24. My G30 also had teeny tiny buttons that all looked the same. BMW fixed this too by doing away with these deadly little bstrds. And alas, my G30's interior, though Burgundian gorgeous, was not very comfortable. BMW also fixed this with their new Veganza seats which are truly the most wonderful seats ever put in a car...
And lastly, my G30 was almost fast enough. Almost. BMW fixed this most existential aspect of the 540 by putting the B58 in this larger, wider frame. This engine is like a Delmonico steak in that the fat has been trimmed but theres still more marbling than in a ribeye. THIS BABY IS FAST!! Its like a toy with the boost paddle and the countdown on the display and the red lights all over in sport mode (nice touch having the hud colors change too). And then you kick down and just FLY down the road!!! The car is a masterpiece.
But its fugly. Theres always this PAUSE when I show it to people. Not my family or friends or other sychophants but complete strangers (whose opinions matter the most, of course). Like the guy who keeps the soap filled down at the self wash for instance.. He took one look at it and knew instantly what it was.. "Is that a '24?" It sure is I replied. PAUSE.. I usually fill this with, "Doesn't look like a bimmer, does it?" And I usually get a polite affirmation.
So nothings perfect. So half the world seems to hate the new bimmers look. Or is it half the world hates the people who drive them? The argument lives on!

[ToddRGuy]

Originally Posted by VicWip

Lifes a trip.. really! My G60 ('24 540i) has been the missing piece in my life, for real! I'm still thinking about it constantly even though the "new" rubbed off last summer. I still read forums like this and everything! Lol! And what a load of horsesht some of it is... I traded in a G30 ('23 540i) when it got up past 120° last summer and dark graphite was no longer sustainable as a color. I got a "new" one that had sat around LA, on different lots, for six months. My new car smell was more like a new car whiff. It seems nobody wants a gas sedan with an "unacceptable" color.
Their loss, my gain! This car has blown me AWAY like no other before it! I loved my G30 but the engine was TOO much for rear wheel drive and it skipped around corners when floored (DEALBREAKER). BMW fixed that by making idrive standard in '24. My G30 also had teeny tiny buttons that all looked the same. BMW fixed this too by doing away with these deadly little bstrds. And alas, my G30's interior, though Burgundian gorgeous, was not very comfortable. BMW also fixed this with their new Veganza seats which are truly the most wonderful seats ever put in a car...
And lastly, my G30 was almost fast enough. Almost. BMW fixed this most existential aspect of the 540 by putting the B58 in this larger, wider frame. This engine is like a Delmonico steak in that the fat has been trimmed but theres still more marbling than in a ribeye. THIS BABY IS FAST!! Its like a toy with the boost paddle and the countdown on the display and the red lights all over in sport mode (nice touch having the hud colors change too). And then you kick down and just FLY down the road!!! The car is a masterpiece.
But its fugly. Theres always this PAUSE when I show it to people. Not my family or friends or other sychophants but complete strangers (whose opinions matter the most, of course). Like the guy who keeps the soap filled down at the self wash for instance.. He took one look at it and knew instantly what it was.. "Is that a '24?" It sure is I replied. PAUSE.. I usually fill this with, "Doesn't look like a bimmer, does it?" And I usually get a polite affirmation.
So nothings perfect. So half the world seems to hate the new bimmers look. Or is it half the world hates the people who drive them? The argument lives on!

Haha, what a colorful and descriptive review of your experience. Thanks for sharing.