[GoingTooFast]

Aesthetically, the new Cayman is in comparison... the Alfa 4c is so beautiful that makes me forget about whoever stands next to it...

[GoingTooFast]

Look at those interiors... how can it even remotely resemble a Lotus?! The Cayman interiors on the other hand look like 'luxury jewelry' in comparison... where is the motorsport racing heritage?!

[GoingTooFast]

Hotter Toyota GT86 could go hybrid

A high-performance petrol-electric hybrid version of the*GT86 sports car is under consideration at*Toyota, Autocar can reveal.*

According to chief engineer Tetsuya Tada, all routes remain open to conjuring more performance from the rear-driven two-seater, with an eye on the creation of a faster and more focussed version of the acclaimed rear-drive coupe to be released later in the car’s lifecycle.*

“I’ve been asked a lot about a turbocharging,” Tada told us. “We are already working on a mid-life facelift for the car, and we are investigating both turbocharging and supercharging too,” he added. “But an electric motor assistance solution is also possible, and would bring benefits that forced induction does not.”

Toyota took the wraps off a*conceptual convertible version of the*GT86*at the Geneva show, which is almost certain to make production. It nearly didn't, however. “The management considered the GT86 very risky,” Tada said. “They wanted proof that the ’86 coupe would hit its sales targets before they would sign off on a convertible. "Now that they have that proof, we can begin to think about other development ideas for the car. But we must guard against compromising any of the key virtues of the standard*GT86*in the pursuit of more power.”

An electric motor assist solution, Tada suggested, could provide a substantial low-rpm torque boost for the naturally aspirated engine without affecting throttle response or compromising on fuel economy or emissions. Similar to the ‘IMA’ system used on the*Honda CRZ, the hybrid system would be much cheaper and simpler than the one used on the Prius economy car. The batteries, meanwhile, could be used to lower the car’s centre of gravity even further.

The Toyota engineer suggested that the weight added by such a system could at least partly be offset, and that experimental underbody aerodynamic parts could be used to adjust the car’s handling balance should weight distribution be affected.

“Our TRD tuning department has found it easy to take 100kg out of the kerbweight, and have developed certain underbody fins and plates that can be employed to alter the dynamic balance of the car, to increase or reduce oversteer at medium and high speeds. They have quite a pronounced effect,” he said.

[GoingTooFast]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

4C is nice, but those headlights are aweful.

Actually, I love those headlights... they add the necessary agressivity while they are also futuristic looking. You can't mistske it for anything else... it's a pity that you will probably only see its back on the road while it goes away:

[GoingTooFast]

So, here we are... on one hand we have the best handling car that less money can buy - the Toyobaru; on the other hand we have the lightest and simultaneously the most gorgeous car that less money can buy - the Alfa 4c.

Two different approaches, two different weight distributions, the same MacPherson struts and Double wishbones - front/ rear for the Toyobaru and rear/ front for the 4c, respectively - both targeting the Cayman from different perspectives and both achieving SIMILAR but significantly better fuel consumption and emissions:

......................................... Toyobaru....................... Alfa 4c....................... Cayman S PDK................ Volkswagen Bluesport Diesel
CO2 emissions................ 159 g/km....................... 157 g/km..................... 188 g/km........................... 113 g/km
Fuel consumption............ 40.9 mpg........................ 41.5 mpg.................... 35.3 mpg........................... 50 mpg
Weight wet, with driver... 1295 kg......................... 1020 kg (est.)............. 1395 kg............................. 1254 kg
Max. Torque..................... 151 lb-ft......................... 258 lb-ft..................... 272 lb-ft............................. 258 lb-ft
Power output................... 197 bhp......................... 240 bhp..................... 320 bhp.............................. 178 bhp
Max. speed...................... 137 mph........................ 158 mph..................... 175 mph............................. 140 mph
0 - 62 mph........................ 7.6 sec........................... 4.5 sec....................... 4.7 sec............................... 6.6 sec


From the above table we can clearly see that low weight in combination with high low-end torque, say from no more than 2000 rpm, which will remain more or less constant throughout the revs will definitely yield to the best performance/consumption results, i.e. greater acceleration from taller gear ratios!

This means that only a turbocharged internal combustion engine OR an electric engine CAN provide MAX torque from the bottom part of the rev counter.

And, in the case of a turbocharged direct fuel injection engine high torque can be easily achieved from a low displacement engine favouring even further fuel consumption. This is without doubt the right formula of which the weight is the MOST critical aspect!!!

I've been defending this solution for years... and although the general public may not be yet ready, the next logical step, the one I've been waiting for since the Volkswagen Bluesport roadster appearance, is to mount a diesel engine in a car like the Alfa 4c. There will be no better way to convince the skeptics than give them a car that performs and looks as beautiful as the 4c or even as the Bluesport roadster concept which had a mid rear mounted diesel engine, 45:55 front/rear weight distribution, 1179 kg of kerb weight and 6-speed dual clutch gearbox... does it sound familiar?! The first company to risk it will be for sure on the leading edge of the industry:

[Aventador97]

I'm glad to see majority of the forum members love this car. My parents are looking to buy one and I think it will turn out to be a great car. It's definitely not the fastest out there but in today's world one of the purist and a true driver's car.

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by GoingTooFast

Funny you have mentioned the Aston... which I think is aesthetically much more closely related to the Toyobaru:

I am sure Yota wish their car looked like an Aston.

Originally Posted by GoingTooFast

Actually, I love those headlights... they add the necessary agressivity while they are also futuristic looking. You can't mistske it for anything else... it's a pity that you will probably only see its back on the road while it goes away:

TVR called...they want their headlights back.

[GoingTooFast]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

I am sure Yota wish their car looked like an Aston.

I don't think they could see any beauty in something above 1300 kg, let alone above 1600 kg... I have the exact same feeling.

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

TVR called...they want their headlights back.

Please do care to show any TVR model whose headlights closely resemble those of the 4c:

[GoingTooFast]

NH3 engine: the car that runs on ammonia

The GT86-R Marangoni has been fitted with the NH3 engine system, offering dual fuel supply. The car can in fact run on petrol, as originally equipped, or alternatively use ammonia stored in a separate rank. The NH3 design has been developed by Bigas International, a company that for more than 40 years has been focusing on the use of alternative energy sources. The system uses a special pressure reducer, called RI21JE, and a special control unit to make sure that all safety and reliability requirements involving the use of ammonia are met.

This system completely eliminates fine dust particle emissions and significantly reduces CO2 emissions. The trials completed by BIGAS International as part of the Savia project analysed every aspect relating to compliance with current safety and pollution standards, testing the effectiveness of the solutions adopted on different prototypes over extended periods.

Ammonia has a higher energy content per kiilogram than petrol, and is consequently an excellent source of energy. Industrial production costs are the same as petrol, however a wider variety of raw materials can be used to make it: coal, natural gas, water, in theory anything that contains hydrogen, carbon and nitrogen can be used, albeit with different yields. Storage and transport are similar to LPG, while the power delivered by the engine is the same as for petrol.

Tyres: Marangoni M-Power EvoRed

For the Toyota GT86-R, Marangoni presents “M-Power EvoRed”, a special set of flame-red 19” tyres. For this experimental version, Marangoni Tyre has developed a highly-ecological tyre, based on the standard M-Power, the maximum in Marangoni technological evolution and applied research.

By using third generation functionalized polymers, designed specifically for better interaction between silica and polymer, and the introduction of innovative experimental nanomaterials as more effective alternative fillers to carbon black, M-Power EvoRed has managed to achieve class B rating for rolling resistance and class A for wet braking. These two values, outstanding for ultra-high performance tyres, confirm the efforts made to ensure lower fuel consumption and increased safety that, together with maximum driving pleasure, are the focus of Marangoni’s main product development guidelines.

[Red Bread]

I'll just leave this here.

[Greenkirby21]

man i loved the VW bluesport. Too bad it never got the green light : (

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by Greenkirby21

man i loved the VW bluesport. Too bad it never got the green light : (

The good cars at VAG never get the green light: VW Bluesport Concept, Audi Quattro Concept, Lamborghini Estoque Concept,...

[GoingTooFast]

Probably I'm alone here but I really like the production version of the 4c more than I liked the concept. In fact, I always thought that the concept headllights were too big and I did find them awkward. On the other hand, I love the solution found by Alfa Romeo for the production version of the 4c... the whole car looks better to me:

[Red Bread]

I liked the show car lights more, but haven't seen either in person. The production lights are certainly more unique and might be great in person. Now if they'd just find a way to offer a three pedaled version, I'd have a next car sorted.

[GoingTooFast]

Some say that there's cheap looking parts on the Alfa Romeo 4C as they say the same about the Toyobaru.

This is the clearest prove that they are thinking about the Cayman. The problem is the new Cayman interiors are GT oriented, they have nothing to do with motorsport racing heritage - in sports cars the interiors should look sportive, right?! Well, the interiors of the Cayman don't look as such... they beg to be driven by a chauffer, albeit a fast one, heading to the supermarket to get the groceries for the Madame seating next to him.

I think the Alfa and the Bluesport interiors, which I find very similar, are the way to go for a sportive and performance oriented car, the very same is true for the 1M, think Ferrari for a minute here. And in the 4c's case you'll get the true carbon fiber interior for a change, not the fake carbon look plastic...

[GoingTooFast]

Just look at the 1M's interiors, what do they have of so special?! And, who cares?!






They can even look more like the Alfa 4c...

[BMW269]

@GoingTooFast: What is this thread about infact?

It is called Subaru BRZ Concept, but since the beginning it we have all news,info and rumors about the Scion FRS/Toyota 86/Subaru BRZ. It is not about the Suabru STI Concept, but just in general about the TOYOBARU. Then there are all sorts of other cars that come up in this thread like Cayman/Boxster, 1M, S2000, MX-5, Renault RS,...... Then yet some completely off-topic F1 stuff. Then you posted 90 % of everything on this thread. Maybe you could start a blog? Or better ask some mods to rename the thread "Official TOYOBARU Thread"? And why do you post Alfa 4C stuff in here? I already started an official 4C thread in this forum sector!

[GoingTooFast]

Strange you have only noticed that now... when you talk about one car, any car, when you give your opinion about it, it's obvious that you should put it all into perspective always from two angles:

1) what is that you value in a car, and

2) the relative aspects of it - how it compares with the other cars you find relevant.


You don't even own a BMW, thus I could think that you being in this forum is already strange, but being here talking about Alfa Romeos and other non-BMW cars is even stranger. But you know what, I don't care. The difference is I'm here because I own a BMW 1M and this forum is called 1addicts.

So please, if you have just discovered that you don't like this thread anymore for whatever reason feel free to not participate in it anylonger. Till then let's talk about cars, shall we ?!

[BMW269]

Originally Posted by GoingTooFast

Strange you have only noticed that now... when you talk about one car, any car, when you give your opinion about it, it's obvious that you should put it all into perspective always from two angles:

1) what is that you value in a car, and

2) the relative aspects of it - how it compares with the other cars you find relevant.


You don't even own a BMW, thus I could think that you being in this forum is already strange, but being here talking about Alfa Romeos and other non-BMW cars is even stranger. But you know what, I don't care. The difference is I'm here because I own a BMW 1M and this forum is called 1addicts.

So please, if you have just discovered that you don't like this thread anymore for whatever reason feel free to not participate in it anylonger. Till then let's talk about cars, shall we ?!

The last posts you made were not a comparission. You could post them in the 4C thread. Anyway I get it, that the best fun cars on the market are the Toyobaru, the Cayman, the 1M, and now the 4C. I don't want to include all the "garage built" cars or Lotus.

[GoingTooFast]

Who said that a 4-cyl turbocharged Toyobaru couldn't sound as good as this turbocharged 4-cyl engine?!... How is that for a comparison?!...

[GoingTooFast]

Definitely, this two cars brought the winds of change... and in a way so fast that they've just left ALL the competition lagging behind in the shadow. These are exciting times for a driving lover... exciting times:

[GoingTooFast]