[Efthreeoh]

Hydrogen Achillies Heel is vaporization during on-board storage. It's not a solvable problem. It is just physics. Hydrogen is great for rockets, personal automobiles not so much.

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

Hydrogen Achillies Heel is vaporization during on-board storage. It's not a solvable problem. It is just physics. Hydrogen is great for rockets, personal automobiles not so much.

Not solvable seems pessimistic Would it be feasible if there was a pump that could keep the tank pressurized to offset the lost volume. Or a tank that could change volume as hydrogen depleted. Not saying it's possible, just thinking outside the box.

[pbonsalb]

Tank heater would increase pressure. Had a heater for my nitrous bottle long ago.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Not solvable seems pessimistic Would it be feasible if there was a pump that could keep the tank pressurized to offset the lost volume. Or a tank that could change volume as hydrogen depleted. Not saying it's possible, just thinking outside the box.

Liquid hydrogen is stored at -200 to -260 deg. C at reasonable pressures to remain portable. It boils off because like any cooler, the tank eventually absorbs heat. The box is affordability tied to the realism of safety...

[dfox]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Id rather instantly explode to death than burn to death. It's a great point though. Can't wait until 3rd parties are trying to save a buck and cars start exploding. As if worrying about other drivers wasn't already bad enough I suspect you can make them quite safe since they can be packaged very small. I don't see how we are suddenly going to have hydrogen fuel cell infrastructure. This seems like something that dealerships would have to initially support.

I mean, maybe, but in an ICE or an EV, the fire isn't usually so instantaneous that you can't just get out of the car. An explosion sure is though.

Hydrogen refueling is pretty complicated, and the stations are pretty expensive. It's not just as simple as taking gas stations and making them hydrogen powered. And they'd likely not be self-service because of the safety concerns of compressed highly flammable gases.

Oh and that's all discounting the fact that hydrogen takes about 3x as much energy as filling up a battery. Everyone concerned that our electricity grid can't handle filling up BEV's... just wait till we have to triple that demand to create hydrogen...

[M5Rick]

Im sticking to basics and so much easier to go with a gas car than an EV, could end up bad with EV charge rage in apartment parking, yep it's M GUY spelling it out again.

[dfox]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Im sticking to basics and so much easier to go with a gas car than an EV, could end up bad with EV charge rage in apartment parking, yep it's M GUY spelling it out again.

It's pretty basic, and repetitious, isn't it? Amazing that there's still people who continue to watch different people say the same thing over and over again... Confirmation bias wins again.

That said, I'd never go EV if I lived in an apartment. But in the house I live, it's incredibly convenient. Pull in and once a week plug in, charge while sleeping. Never have to think about stopping for gas on my drives. For a daily commuter, it's quite the luxury experience.

For my other cars - nah, ev sucks. I'll keep my six speed bimmer for jollies and my mountain/road trip suv as ICE.

[M5Rick]

^ Even so, it's important to being shown again (thought it looked familiar) so that EV buyers in apartments don't fall into the same trap as Miguel Frolich did. The bottom line here is to never rush into anything particularly when buying an EV before doing the homework..

[dreamingat30fps]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

^ Even so, it's important to being shown again (thought it looked familiar) so that EV buyers in apartments don't fall into the same trap as Miguel Frolich did. The bottom line here is to never rush into anything particularly when buying an EV before doing the homework..

The same can be said about anything. However we don't have 445 page threads about those.

Anyways to answer the original question again, yes I still want an EV, so much so I just traded in the Model 3 for the new highland Model 3. I gotta say it's better in almost every way. Can't wait to see what the new Y is going to be like.

High probability I will be trading in the Cayenne for another EV in the next few months. Might venture outside of Tesla and try something else or might not.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by dreamingat30fps

The same can be said about anything. However we don't have 445 page threads about those.

Anyways to answer the original question again, yes I still want an EV, so much so I just traded in the Model 3 for the new highland Model 3. I gotta say it's better in almost every way. Can't wait to see what the new Y is going to be like.

High probability I will be trading in the Cayenne for another EV in the next few months. Might venture outside of Tesla and try something else or might not.

Being such a tentative subject as EV's it could well go to 1445 pages .

[eugenebmw]

Joke of the day.

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1013933857159148

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by eugenebmw

Joke of the day.

https://www.facebook.com/reel/1013933857159148

Good one EugeneBMW, made my day

[eugenebmw]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

Good one EugeneBMW, made my day

I think that driver has a really bad day. $150000 piece of junk can't even move in less than one inch of melting snow.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by eugenebmw

I think that driver has a really bad day. $150000 piece of junk can't even move in less than one inch of melting snow.

Cyberstuck

[afadeev]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

One of my bosses has a Tesla and he's pretty fed up by the lack of infrastructure. He has to drive a lot spontaneously so dependency on home charging doesn't always work. Tesla chargers often have lines and can add hours to his trips.

That's too much fear-mongering.
I've been driving BMWs and ///M cars for 30+ years and EVs for 10+ years.
EV charging infrastructure is extremely well developed along both coasts. Especially the Tesla (L3) SuperChargers.
Over 7+ years of Tesla ownership, I've yet to EVER wait in line for an EV charger, and I've taken Teslas on multiple 500+ mile trips requiring on-the-road charging stops.

The only exception that I can site is my workplace, now that EV adoption has exceeded the supply of the installed L2 EV chargers (~20 of them) about a year or two ago.

Originally Posted by Germanauto

He's often late and has to call into conferences while sitting in his car at a charging station.

When I'm late for a work meeting, it's usually because I am having too much fun driving my car and want to enjoy the drive.
In either the ///M3, or one of the EVs.

Originally Posted by dfox

Hydrogen has zero infrastructure in the US, and yet EV haters who constantly complain about the charging network think hydrogen is going to be a solution?

Neah.
They just cite hydrogen (economically and environmentally non-viable) as an excuse to downplay EV appeal and adoption.
The same folks are happy to argue that "EVs are not ready", and we should wait for "solid-state batteries" before EVs should be seriously considered.

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I do think EVs suit the needs of your avg consumer really well. But for people who cannot depend on charging at home it can be very difficult and add a lot of anxiety. An EV can work for you 95% of the time, but that 5% of the time it doesn't can completely ruin your day.

I would not recommend an EV as one and only car to a Mid-Westerner. Or someone who doesn't have ready access to L2/L3 chargers at home or at work. Charge while you work/sleep is just way to convenient to not partake.
As a 2nd or 3rd car - EVs are great.
As a daily driver/commuter car - EVs are absolutely PERFECT for financial and tech assistance/ADAS reasons.

Originally Posted by Germanauto

Also, EVs don't yet work for enthusiasts who value sound, shifting gears, light weight etc. However even most "enthusiasts" just think 0-60 = sports car. It's just a small contingent of us who really "get" it.

"Enthusiasts" or "weirdos"?
I know many non-car friends who think it's the latter.

Having said all that, I do prefer driving the ///M3. Every time. On track and to work.
My wife and kids prefer the EVs.

YMMV,
a

[RM7]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Not solvable seems pessimistic Would it be feasible if there was a pump that could keep the tank pressurized to offset the lost volume. Or a tank that could change volume as hydrogen depleted. Not saying it's possible, just thinking outside the box.

Yeah, you can just keep a bunch of liquid nitrogen around to cool it down. I'm sure that doesn't use any energy.

[zvez]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Tesla $450ish a share.
He is literally jumping up and down in his Occupy Mars t-shirt on a shekel mountain.
Peeking at a half a trilsky net worth.

...didn't Creepster Gates short Tesla in a big way?

tesla shares have spiked because he's literally going to be "first dude" (where's melania?). So anything related to ev will be massaged for max benefit to tesla/musk.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by afadeev

T







"Enthusiasts" or "weirdos"?
I know many non-car friends who think it's the latter.

Having said all that, I do prefer driving the ///M3. Every time. On track and to work.

YMMV,
a

---

I would turn that around a mite and put the enthusiasts first who may think that non-car people are lost souls, ships that just pass in the night .
But...glad you prefer your gas M3

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by zvez

tesla shares have spiked because he's literally going to be "first dude" (where's melania?). So anything related to ev will be massaged for max benefit to tesla/musk.

[gonzo]

Originally Posted by zvez

tesla shares have spiked because he's literally going to be "first dude" (where's melania?). So anything related to ev will be massaged for max benefit to tesla/musk.

Like all electric by 2035 mandates and stuff?

The thickness of the jelly towards him is wild. Higher net than 2 Bez and 3 Zuk combined will do that.
TV taught.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by gonzo

Like all electric by 2035 mandates and stuff?

The thickness of the jelly towards him is wild. Higher net than 2 Bez and 3 Zuk combined will do that.
TV taught.

It will be interesting to see how SpaceX and Mars plays out with Muskey as budgetmeister.

[not a political statement, just a comment regarding Organizational Conflict of Interest]

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by M5Rick

---

I would turn that around a mite and put the enthusiasts first who may think that non-car people are lost souls, ships that just pass in the night .
But...glad you prefer your gas M3

He drives an ///M3? I must have missed that...