[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

Hmmm, Orlando, Miami, Melbourne, West Palm, Boca, ft Lauderdale, Naples, etc. All of it. 21 million people in Florida, majority in this area. I actually saw a bmw 507 driving around, and 2 tesla x this year. Hmmm

They?re pretty boring, maybe you?re just looking right past them? I?ve seen two Roadsters this year in Texas.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

They?re pretty boring, maybe you?re just looking right past them? I?ve seen two Roadsters this year in Texas.

Nah. They are distinctive. Stand out like a sore thumb. Roadster what.

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

Exactly what I posted on the page before. But tesla wants the image, the media wants to push EV, so they do the bs comparison to full size luxury while it's a midsize. It's not a case of agreeing or disagreeing. It's a case of fact or fiction. Car sizes and prices are measurable quantifiable facts. As usual the left wants to believe the fiction because it pushes their narrative.

I wasn't talking about you agreeing or disagreeing at all. I think you've got it right. My snarky comment was about social media in general. It seems that no matter the topic, nobody can agree on anything at all.

Tesla had me thinking the S was an s-class competitor. It's only after I read the link I posted that I realized its smaller and less expensive and more in line with e-class and 5ers. Tesla has done a good job in that regard.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

I wasn't talking about you agreeing or disagreeing at all. I think you've got it right. My snarky comment was about social media in general. It seems that no matter the topic, nobody can agree on anything at all.

Tesla had me thinking the S was an s-class competitor. It's only after I read the link I posted that I realized its smaller and less expensive and more in line with e-class and 5ers. Tesla has done a good job in that regard.

Agreed. It's great at marketing and hype, and making up different stats to measure them by. It's a paper tiger. If the 3 series doesn't sell as they project its in serious trouble. And the deck is stacked against that.

[Fundguy1]

Read this.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/410...apgate-emerges

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

Nah. They are distinctive. Stand out like a sore thumb. Roadster what.

Tesla Roadster. Original product.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Tesla Roadster. Original product.

Never heard of it let alone seen one. You've seen more of those than I have tesla x. Still looking.

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by solstice

I absolutely agree, once the traditional luxury car makers have competitive models and charging stations deployed they should regain control. But when the question is if the fossil fuel powered 3 series including hybrids is under threat of Model 3 I think the answer is a big yes. The upper luxury sedan buyers have showned that they prefer Model S and to ignore that when it comes to the starting luxury sedans make little sense IMO.

I think it will come down to if Tesla can deliver on announced price and keep up with demand but we'll see.

Model 3 will have some competition from electric G20 3series(250 mile range). We will see how is stacks up and how it is priced.

Tesla will soon run out of $7500 fed tax credits for their cars. Once they hit 200,000 vehicles, it will half in next two quarters. Then half again following two quarters, before phasing out completely.

Projections have Tesla hitting 200k in first quarter 2018, which puts 2019 as first year without tax credit. Certainly that will hurt model 3 sales, effectively adding a $7500 premium to their “affordable” car.

[Fundguy1]

Saw a bald eagle. No EVs yet. Still driving.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by BlackJetE90

Model 3 will have some competition from electric G20 3series(250 mile range). We will see how is stacks up and how it is priced.

Tesla will soon run out of $7500 fed tax credits for their cars. Once they hit 200,000 vehicles sold, it will half in next two quarters. Then half again following two quarters, before phasing out completely.

Projections have Tesla hitting 200k in first quarter 2018, which puts 2019 as first year without tax credit. Certainly that will hurt model 3 sales, effectively adding a $7500 premium to the car.

Yes though the announced $35k starting price is before credits. I believe it when I see it...

[Fundguy1]

Saw another note. No leafs.

[solstice]

Another must if Tesla is to eat the 3 series lunch is attractive lease deals. People with lesser means than the $100k car buying crowd are big into leasing and coupled with the valid concerns of used value / battery longevity good lease terms is imperative.

[Fundguy1]

Home. Saw a few thousand cars. 1 ev. A lone tesla s.

[solstice]

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

Home. Saw a few thousand cars. 1 ev. A lone tesla s.

I just picked up one of my daughters, three Model X in the pickup line, two Model S, one RR and one S class. Three more Model S on the road and one Model X. No S class or 7 series but one E class. This was for a 15 minute drive...
So your point of the south vs the north in this regard seems valid from our mini sample

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by solstice

I just picked up one of my daughters, three Model X in the pickup line, two Model S, one RR and one S class. Three more Model S on the road and one Model X. No S class or 7 series but one E class. This was for a 15 minute drive...
So your point of the south vs the north in this regard seems valid from our mini sample

Yup. What state are you in? I can't imagine NYC area where i grew up embracing ev cars much either. Boston however...

[Red Bread]

Saw six Model S in the five miles I remembered to pay attention tonight, one Model X and a DB11, GT3 RS and a Bentayga.

[Sedoy]

Actually if you compare the 2012 Tesla Model S (the year Model S was released) to 2012 7-series and 2012 S-class the difference is much closer.

2012 Model S - 196″
2012 BMW 7 Series (SWB US) - 200″
2012 Mercedes-Benz S-Class (SWB for Europe) - 199.8"
2012 Mercedes-Benz S-Class (LWB) - 205"

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

2017 Tesla Model S/Dimensions
196″ L x 77″ W x 57″ H

2017 Mercedes-Benz S-Class/Dimensions
207″ L x 75″ W x 59″ H

2017 BMW 7 Series/Dimensions
207″ L x 75″ W x 58″ H

2017 Mercedes-Benz E-Class/Dimensions
194″ L x 74″ W x 58″ H

2017 BMW 5 Series/Dimensions
197″ L x 75″ W x 61″ H

Tesla S price
Starts at $69,200.00

S class price
Starts at $96k

BMW 750i
Starts at $96k

BMW 5 series price
Start with a 550xi to be fair, starts at $83k

MB e class 550 4matic
Starts at $61k

Tesla s class sales 14,770
E class 32,751
5 series 24,799

Questions?

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by Sedoy

Actually if you compare the 2012 Tesla Model S (the year Model S was released) to 2012 7-series and 2012 S-class the difference is much closer.

2012 Model S - 196″
2012 BMW 7 Series (SWB US) - 200″
2012 Mercedes-Benz S-Class (SWB for Europe) - 199.8"
2012 Mercedes-Benz S-Class (LWB) - 205"

No
2012 Mercedes-Benz S550
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 mercedes s550 size
Dimensions: 207″ L x 74″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 4,740 lbs

2012 BMW 750i
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 bmw 750i size
Dimensions: 205″ L x 75″ W x 59″ H
Curb weight: 4,564 lbs

2012 Mercedes-Benz E350 sedan
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 mercedes e350 size
Dimensions: 192″ L x 74″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 3,883 lbs

2012 BMW 550i
Luxury vehicle
Image result for bmw 2012 550i size
Dimensions: 193″ L x 73″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 4,365 lbs

2012 Tesla Model S
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 tesla s size
Dimensions: 196″ L x 77″ W x 57″ H
Curb weight: 4,647 lbs


It was 4 inches longer than an e class, 3 than a 5 series, and 11 inches shorter than an s class, 9 less than a 7 series. Just like tesla to brag about how long they are until the truth is revealed in the locker room.

[Sedoy]

Not really sure from where you're pulling those numbers, but the correct dimensions are:

BMW F01:
SWB: 5,072 mm (199.7 in)
LWB: 5,212 mm (205.2 in)

W221:
(since 2009) SWB: 5,079 mm (200.0 in)
(since 2009) LWB: 5,209 mm (205.1 in)

750i SWB


W221 SWB:

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

No
2012 Mercedes-Benz S550
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 mercedes s550 size
Dimensions: 207″ L x 74″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 4,740 lbs

2012 BMW 750i
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 bmw 750i size
Dimensions: 205″ L x 75″ W x 59″ H
Curb weight: 4,564 lbs

2012 Mercedes-Benz E350 sedan
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 mercedes e350 size
Dimensions: 192″ L x 74″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 3,883 lbs

2012 BMW 550i
Luxury vehicle
Image result for bmw 2012 550i size
Dimensions: 193″ L x 73″ W x 58″ H
Curb weight: 4,365 lbs

2012 Tesla Model S
Luxury vehicle
Image result for 2012 tesla s size
Dimensions: 196″ L x 77″ W x 57″ H
Curb weight: 4,647 lbs


It was 4 inches longer than an e class, 3 than a 5 series, and 11 inches shorter than an s class, 9 less than a 7 series. Just like tesla to brag about how long they are until the truth is revealed in the locker room.

[Red Bread]

Get out of here with facts. He?s MAD and doesn?t like Tesla. Just let him throw his little tantrum.

Slow morning, two Xs, an Aztek (oddly similar) and -RR Wraith.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by Sedoy

Not really sure from where you're pulling those numbers, but the correct dimensions are:

BMW F01:
SWB: 5,072 mm (199.7 in)
LWB: 5,212 mm (205.2 in)

W221:
(since 2009) SWB: 5,079 mm (200.0 in)
(since 2009) LWB: 5,209 mm (205.1 in)

750i SWB


W221 SWB:

I'm not using the rarely-sold, short wheelbase models. I’m using the most commonly sold normal size.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Get out of here with facts. He?s MAD and doesn?t like Tesla. Just let him throw his little tantrum.

Slow morning, two Xs, an Aztek (oddly similar) and -RR Wraith.

None today. Drove 200 miles so far through south Florida. Boca raton and ft Lauderdale area. Plenty of Porsche panamericas and maserati quattroportes.