[Murf993]

Originally Posted by upstatedoc

Any idea why so many Leo's don't want the Covid vaccine and are willing to quit or get laid off because of it?

They don't trust government?

[Fly320s]

Originally Posted by upstatedoc

Any idea why so many Leo's don't want the Covid vaccine and are willing to quit or get laid off because of it?

They don't want to be forced to take medicine they don't want?

[upstatedoc]

OK, maybe I should have kept that question to myself

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by upstatedoc

Any idea why so many Leo's don't want the Covid vaccine and are willing to quit or get laid off because of it?

Freedom to choose and the politics surrounding the push for this vaccine. They don't require/mandate Hep A/B, flu, etc. vaccines. They don't threaten to fire us over a whole bunch of other stuff, but they are threatening in this case. They even fail to consider natural immunity as if it doesn't have any value. I could go on for a very long time about this, but let me just say…..


….at my station we have a mixture of vaccinated and unvaccinated deputies and staff. During the height of COVID, we were hit hard, albeit with some just 'playing it up' to get the automatic two weeks off on the county's dime. In these two years I have seen people who are vaccinated be infected multiple times [and recover fine], people who are unvaccinated be infected multiple times [and recover fine], people who were unvaccinated/vaccinated and who succumbed to the virus [R.I.P.], people who experienced severe complications - including blindness and lumps under the skin - and people like myself who never caught COVID despite being around a significant number of COVID+ people (…and if we did, were asymptomatic and fought it off without ever realizing we were infected). I've also never had the flu in my life, but I digress….

I am not a fan of being forced to take medicine I do not want and I do not trust big government to have the best interest(s) of the people at heart (…and neither should anybody else). The government has shown in the past the willingness to experiment on people using 'vaccines' (…and in the name of public health) and I honestly believe this is just another case of that. Regardless of what side of the line you fall on, I respect your right to choose.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by upstatedoc

OK, maybe I should have kept that question to myself

You new?

[jamesinaz]

Originally Posted by upstatedoc

Any idea why so many Leo's don't want the Covid vaccine and are willing to quit or get laid off because of it?

I knew this wasn't gonna end well.

For myself (not a cop) I believe the vaccine is a good idea. I've had it and will get the booster on the 22nd. Then again I am over 65 and have underlying issues. And I intend to travel to SE Asia in January.

But I get it how the .gov is shoving it down peoples throats and that doesn't set will with many. Typical of a control mania mentality the current administration is telling us "for our own good" it will require people to get the vaccine or suffer consequences. And typical of big government morons they don't understand the anger over being told what to do.

IMO they should have left it as a choice. I think we have more resistance now because of their handling of it not more getting the vaccine.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by jamesinaz

I knew this wasn't gonna end well.

For myself (not a cop) I believe the vaccine is a good idea. I've had it and will get the booster on the 22nd. Then again I am over 65 and have underlying issues. And I intend to travel to SE Asia in January.

But I get it how the .gov is shoving it down peoples throats and that doesn't set will with many. Typical of a control mania mentality the current administration is telling us "for our own good" it will require people to get the vaccine or suffer consequences. And typical of big government morons they don't understand the anger over being told what to do.

IMO they should have left it as a choice. I think we have more resistance now because of their handling of it not more getting the vaccine.

Exactly! Had they left it as a choice, naturally, they would've gained more compliance. Most of the people I know who opted to get the vaccine did it long before the talk of mandates; it was a decision made voluntarily based on health, travel plans, etc. Many who are standing their ground might've eventually changed course given the choice, but being told what to do leads many to resist out of spite. I wouldn't have done it regardless.

[jamesinaz]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Exactly! Had they left it as a choice, naturally, they would've gained more compliance. Most of the people I know who opted to get the vaccine did it long before the talk of mandates; it was a decision made voluntarily based on health, travel plans, etc. Many who are standing their ground might've eventually changed course given the choice, but being told what to do leads many to resist out of spite. I wouldn't have done it regardless.

And I'm OK if you opt out. I feel safe having had it and no reason I need you to make the same choice.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Exactly! Had they left it as a choice, naturally, they would've gained more compliance. Most of the people I know who opted to get the vaccine did it long before the talk of mandates; it was a decision made voluntarily based on health, travel plans, etc. Many who are standing their ground might've eventually changed course given the choice, but being told what to do leads many to resist out of spite. I wouldn't have done it regardless.

Nonsense. In NYC the cops & firefighters have such low vaccination #s that will just ensure spread. That was before the vaccine mandate. And they don't wear masks in the supermarket.
Just pretend you are in the army & buck up.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

Nonsense. In NYC the cops & firefighters have such low vaccination #s that will just ensure spread. That was before the vaccine mandate. And they don't wear masks in the supermarket.
Just pretend you are in the army & buck up.

Given the prevailing political attitude in NYC is it any surprise the NYPD and NYFD have low vaccination rates. The thing you don't understand about the cops is this, they enforce the laws but are generally not trusting of government. Push back should seem quite normal.....carrot and the stick my friend.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Murf993

Given the prevailing political attitude in NYC is it any surprise the NYPD and NYFD have low vaccination rates. The thing you don't understand about the cops is this, they enforce the laws but are generally not trusting of government. Push back should seem quite normal.....carrot and the stick my friend.

Considering that the low vaccine rate is not limited to NYC cops & firefighters, but nationally is killing cops at ~ six times wot guns do, I don't see the prevailing political attitude of NYC being a major factor.
We all indulge our mental flights & fears. Getting over such is one of the battles life. I really don't understand why police unions would come out against vaccinations. These are people of authority & influence. For some reason they act like their sh!t don't stink.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Murf993

Given the prevailing political attitude in NYC is it any surprise the NYPD and NYFD have low vaccination rates. The thing you don't understand about the cops is this, they enforce the laws but are generally not trusting of government. Push back should seem quite normal.....carrot and the stick my friend.

Haven't we learned to kind of just ignore him? No matter what we say, we're always wrong (…and we're the ones with the experience and/or perspective).

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Haven't you learned to kind of just ignore him?

Pls. Clan, why do any police unions come out against vaccinations of their members? It seems like Darwinism at work.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Haven't you learned to kind of just ignore him?

Might be the rum talkin'

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Murf993

Might be the rum talkin'

Clan has posted when cops die for other reasons. I haven't seen him post about any cops dying of covid, which has been by far the leading cause of cops deaths for '20 & '21.
And Clan is not alone in that. Sadly, it's too predictable.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

Clan has posted when cops die for other reasons. I haven't seen him post about any cops dying of covid, which has been by far the leading cause of cops deaths for '20 & '21.
And Clan is not alone in that.

There aren't many dying solely because of COVID. Most had underlying health issues prior to COVID.

[Murf993]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

There aren't many dying solely because of COVID. Most had underlying health issues prior to COVID.

And this is the problem. No good statistical breakdown, no hard facts. This will get into politics quickly but let me take a shot (might be the rum talking), how many covid deaths have been recorded that were completely not covid related ie; died with covid rather than from covid. I suspect that if we did a proper tear down the facts would show that the vast majority of people who died were over 80, with co-morbidities. No doubt younger people died, but the vast majority of those also had co-morbidities and were likely obese too boot.

The problem our friend has is he can't separate his anti police distain/fanboy thing to be reasonable with the points he wants to make.....

I like to call that poking the badger. Defiantly the rum talking.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

There aren't many dying solely because of COVID. Most had underlying health issues prior to COVID.

Before covid there were "co-morbidities", in addition to whatever cause was assigned to be the major cause.
This is why the stat, deaths above expected (?) is so important. We know lots of cops have high blood pressure, as always, but they generally live with it, like they do with many other health problems!

But stop putting up straw men. The personal indulgence of entertaining mental blocks which prevent you from doing what is right is nothing new, or something to be proud of.

Cheers, Murf.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Haven't we learned to kind of just ignore him? No matter what we say, we're always wrong (…and we're the ones with the experience and/or perspective).

This is a problem with the machostupid; they always think they are the ones with experience & perspective.
Cops are not exceptions to humanity. They can wear horse blinders, too, like many other folk. The point I asked about, the low vaccine rates among cops & firefighters, puts them in company with other low education groups in vaccination rates. What can I say? Go shoot yourself in the foot?
It would be nice if you could deal with the points I put up instead of claiming privilege of some sort.

[Sedan_Clan]

Originally Posted by Littlebear

This is a problem with the machostupid; they always think they are the ones with experience & perspective.
Cops are not exceptions to humanity. They can wear horse blinders, too, like many other folk. The point I asked about, the low vaccine rates among cops & firefighters, puts them in company with other low education groups in vaccination rates. What can I say? Go shoot yourself in the foot?
It would be nice if you could deal with the points I put up instead of claiming privilege of some sort.

Draw your own conclusions. Nothing I tell you will resonate with you anyway.

[Littlebear]

Originally Posted by Sedan_Clan

Draw your own conclusions. Nothing I tell you will resonate with you anyway.

You're acting like I'm the only person who wonders why cops & firefighters have such low vaccine #s in the face of such high covid death #s. I can only assume it's because so many belong to the "Leopard Ate My Face" party.

[Joekerr]

ITT

Littlebear broke Sedan_Clan patience. This isn't a failing on Sedan's part, he has always conducted himself with a ton of patience ITT, it was more just an inevitable outcome where the only unknown was when. I was amazed he was as patient as he was for as long as he was.

I rarely try to rationalize with Littlebear anymore.

With the exception of abortion I suppose - I always try to rationalize with anyone on that topic as it might save someone's life. Interestingly, he doesn't like to talk or share much about that topic though.