[b0bab0i]

Have you considered CTS-V?

[DimSum]

M3. At the end of the day, the M3 trumps all the car on track and handling.

[Sephiroth]

You are doing it wrong!

Get the car that speaks to you, then find a way to keep it. Find a warranty or get it CPO.

Don't settle for 2nd best, especially when you are spending that much money!

[Chenry135]

Originally Posted by Stoutnj89

Bashing lexus again... HAHA.. If u don't want a headache, get a lexus...

LOL, everyone always says this. My mom's IS250 is in the shop just about every other week. MY grandmothers SC430 (I know, god awful car) is in the shop almost as much. Finally My other grandparents have an ES, which hasn't had any problems, but you have to be at least 70 to get one of those...

[M3_WC]

I have seen CPO M3's for mid $40k range.

So cost of ownership should be a non-factor.

Buy the car you enjoy driving the most.

[cssnms]

Drove both, the C63 AMG and the CTS-V, hands down the C63 was my favorite, the CTS-V came in a close second. Ended up getting the "d" go figure.

The IS-F or any Lexus for that matter is not cheap to maintain, but the IS-F is more expensive than any other Lexus to maintain. The breaks and rotors do not last very long and they are VERY expensive to replace and so is just about anything else you need done including an oil change. IMO the IS-F was more fun to drive than the M3 and it's more economical. The growl of that IS-F V-8 takes second place only to the C63. As far as looks go, the M3 looks nicer IMO and it handles better. It really comes down to what's more important to you and what car you like the looks of the best. Can't really go wrong in this dept.

[-c-]

IS-F AS-IF

again just another overpriced Toyota, Lexus stood for "luxury - Xport - US"
and if you go to other places around the world you see cars that have Toyota badges on them where they have Lexus badges here.

kind of like when GM took what basically was a cavalier from Opel and stuck a Cadillac badge on it here. were all suckers to buy into branding, well at least some branding.

at least you know a BMW is a BMW anywhere in the world it goes.

don’t care for Toyotas styling their cars have no soul and..... well.. you can keep em.

sorry but I hate the company just as much as Wal-Mart! but that’s just my opinion. sorry I couldn’t help give good advice.

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by cssnms

Drove both, the C63 AMG and the CTS-V, hands down the C63 was my favorite, the CTS-V came in a close second. Ended up getting the "d" go figure.

The IS-F or any Lexus for that matter is not cheap to maintain, but the IS-F is more expensive than any other Lexus to maintain. The breaks and rotors do not last very long and they are VERY expensive to replace and so is just about anything else you need done including an oil change. IMO the IS-F was more fun to drive than the M3 and it's more economical. The growl of that IS-F V-8 takes second place only to the C63. As far as looks go, the M3 looks nicer IMO and it handles better. It really comes down to what's more important to you and what car you like the looks of the best. Can't really go wrong in this dept.

More comments from people that have zero idea about this car. I've had mine for 2 1/2 years with 30 000 miles on it. Regular maintenance....that is it...that is all. The car has been almost bullet proof. Common experience for most of the F owners I know.

To the OP, spend some time on the Lexus boards (ClubLexus is especially good) and do some research there. You will find much more open, honest discussion about all brands. You will also see that the IS F has been a remarkably reliable vehicle with very few problems overall. There have been zero significant engine issues or tranny problems.

As far as performance goes, they are close enough that everything is going to be a driver's race. Bench racing means absolutely nothing in the real world. The M3 is a great car that is a popular choice, but like every vehicle, it isn't perfect.

Ultimately, out of warranty there is a much greater chance of experiencing high maintenance costs with the M3 than the IS F. The stats don't lie. Lexus is more reliable than BMW...period.

Good luck with your decision....there isn't a wrong choice with either of them.

The few good posts in any thread discussing this car (or any competitor for that matter) are always drowned out by the rabid fanbois that call themselves enthusiasts but are nothing more than badge whores.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

More comments from people that have zero idea about this car. I've had mine for 2 1/2 years with 30 000 miles on it. Regular maintenance....that is it...that is all. The car has been almost bullet proof. Common experience for most of the F owners I know.

Do you know of anyone that has serviced it outside of the warranty. I am sure it is not cheap. I have owned a Lexus before.

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

The M3 is a great car that is a popular choice, but like every vehicle, it isn't perfect.

For this segment, the M3 is about as perfect as you can get. It is a bonus you can get the car in coupe, sedan, or vert.

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

Ultimately, out of warranty there is a much greater chance of experiencing high maintenance costs with the M3 than the IS F. The stats don't lie. Lexus is more reliable than BMW...period.

I wouldn't own either car out of warranty. CPO would be a great suggestion.

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

Good luck with your decision....there isn't a wrong choice with either of them.

The few good posts in any thread discussing this car (or any competitor for that matter) are always drowned out by the rabid fanbois that call themselves enthusiasts but are nothing more than badge whores.

I agree. I will add the IS-F is a great car.

[lve2xlr8]

[Cdnrockies]

Originally Posted by M3_WC

Do you know of anyone that has serviced it outside of the warranty. I am sure it is not cheap. I have owned a Lexus before.

Not possible.

Every IS F is still in warranty unless someone has run up extremely high mileage in a short period of time. I guess "cheap" is all relative. Don't even get me started on what MB charges...lol.

For this segment, the M3 is about as perfect as you can get. It is a bonus you can get the car in coupe, sedan, or vert.

I'm not sure about that anymore, especially in light of the new versions from MB and Lexus. Don't get me wrong, I know it's a great car but there are some imperfections as well. Can we agree that all of the cars in this segment are fun, but heavily compromised as far as sports cars are concerned?

And to your point about the bonus. I think the M3 coupe is dead sexy, but there are several other 2 doors I'd look at for performance (ie. GT R, Z06/R1, 911). The Vert is more heavily compromised than the other versions. I've assumed all along we've been discussing the sedan as it is the direct comparison to the C63, IS F and CTS V. It certainly does offer something to everyone however.

I wouldn't own either car out of warranty. CPO would be a great suggestion.

Fair statement. I have no intention on owning mine out of warranty.

I agree. I will add the IS-F is a great car.

Thanks for the mature...actual discussion about cars.

[Inspired]

Originally Posted by Chenry135

LOL, everyone always says this. My mom's IS250 is in the shop just about every other week. MY grandmothers SC430 (I know, god awful car) is in the shop almost as much. Finally My other grandparents have an ES, which hasn't had any problems, but you have to be at least 70 to get one of those...

What kind of problems does the 250 have? I know many people with 250/350 and have absolutely no problems while I hear horror stories with BMW breaking down all the time.

[Inspired]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

This is old. 2009. Try matching the newer ISF against the newer M3..

[DimSum]

Originally Posted by twinturbo335

This is old. 2009. Try matching the newer ISF against the newer M3..

the IS-F sucks.

[radiantm3]

Originally Posted by twinturbo335

This is old. 2009. Try matching the newer ISF against the newer M3..

The OP's deciding between 2008 cars.

I had no interest in the IS-F (or C63 for that matter) because neither came in a proper manual transmission. Not even a dual clutch.

[majin ssj eric]

I'd pass on an 08 but the new IS-F is no joke. It is definitely just as fast as the M3 (check out C&D's recent Lightning Lap)...

[stickypaws]

Get the car you really want. Forget the reliability crap. And forget what others prefer. You'll be changing cars again anyway. If you buy based on anything outside your personal desires, and not on what honestly tickles your own butt, then you're just being unfair to yourself in the long run. And sometimes a sexy drama queen is better than a loyal ice queen. Makes life memorable.

[Year's_End]

Originally Posted by stickypaws

Get the car you really want. Forget the reliability crap. And forget what others prefer. You'll be changing cars again anyway. If you buy based on anything outside your personal desires, and not on what honestly tickles your own butt, then you're just being unfair to yourself in the long run. And sometimes a sexy drama queen is better than a loyal ice queen. Makes life memorable.

This.

And as far as reliability goes, I think it's a little hard to judge the IS-F's reliability based on the rest of the brand's history. My reasoning is based off of the fact that the company has regularly built average performing, comfortable cars, with a clientele that's more likely than not to push the make's cars less than other, performance-oriented brands (BMW, Audi, what have you). I think the extra wear spirited drivers put on a brand's cars will have a high impact on the cars' overall reliability through the course of their existence.

Which brings me to the IS-F. It's a performance sedan that's high-strung (relative to the rest of the Lexus lineup) with a stiff suspension. It's pursuing the market inclined towards more aggressive driving. I'm just thinking it'd be hard to compare its reliability to past Lexus models.

[Elie335]

m3.

[cssnms]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

More comments from people that have zero idea about this car. I've had mine for 2 1/2 years with 30 000 miles on it. Regular maintenance....that is it...that is all. The car has been almost bullet proof. Common experience for most of the F owners I know.

To the OP, spend some time on the Lexus boards (ClubLexus is especially good) and do some research there. You will find much more open, honest discussion about all brands. You will also see that the IS F has been a remarkably reliable vehicle with very few problems overall. There have been zero significant engine issues or tranny problems.

As far as performance goes, they are close enough that everything is going to be a driver's race. Bench racing means absolutely nothing in the real world. The M3 is a great car that is a popular choice, but like every vehicle, it isn't perfect.

Ultimately, out of warranty there is a much greater chance of experiencing high maintenance costs with the M3 than the IS F. The stats don't lie. Lexus is more reliable than BMW...period.

Good luck with your decision....there isn't a wrong choice with either of them.

The few good posts in any thread discussing this car (or any competitor for that matter) are always drowned out by the rabid fanbois that call themselves enthusiasts but are nothing more than badge whores.

No idea ahout this car???? That statement sure is far reaching isn't it? I am not a BMW fanboy, as a matter of fact I am probably more of a Lexus die-hard. I have own/owned as many Lexus vehicles as BMW's - take another look at my signature block. I know you from the Club Lexus board and although I have not been active on the IS-F forum lately I was certainly in the mix, esp back during the Andy MHP days and everything that went down with Juanco. I know this car very well and I am also more then familiar with what it cost to maintain the car. I am also aware of the complaints by MANY owners regarding brakes/rotors prematuraly needing to be replaced. And unless Lexus has dropped there prices which I doubt, you also cannot deny that the rotors for the IS-F are VERY expensive as are the brake pads. What's the cost per axle again? Sure you can chaulk some of that up to how people drive, but you don't hear about this problem w/C63 owners or M3 owners. In addition, the brake dust is so bad on the IS-F that it eats the finish on the wheels, another common complaint. The dealer cost to change the oil in the IS-F is also higher than any other Lexus. Look, I like the car, I drove it many times and I have talked to my SA at Lexus about it at length. I was SO close to buying it that I almost considered myself an owner. I hung out on the IS-F forum back in the day with the likes of you, BIGMike and the rest of what I will call the original crew and I know more about this car than many owners. Now a days I find myself relegated to the GX section.

Anyway they are great cars, Lexus makes a fine vehicle (I know I own/owned 2). The IS-F will be the most reliable long term, but again it is costly to maintain. Is it more costly than an M3 after the maintance program or warranty expire; probably not. OP do your homewor and search on Club Lexus. Like I said before you can't go wrong either way IMO, but don't overlook the C63, it's an animal.

[DASHOCKER]

Originally Posted by Cdnrockies

More comments from people that have zero idea about this car. I've had mine for 2 1/2 years with 30 000 miles on it. Regular maintenance....that is it...that is all. The car has been almost bullet proof. Common experience for most of the F owners I know.

To the OP, spend some time on the Lexus boards (ClubLexus is especially good) and do some research there. You will find much more open, honest discussion about all brands.

I disagree with this statement. I've been a member of clublexus longer than you (since 2004). It can be quite overbearing especially on the car chat forum. Posts deleted, warnings infractions galore if you go against the grain by some who have not been on this Earth no longer than me. The forum has gone down hill & others share my sentiment by no longer posting as much or at all. This forum is less overbearing and allows one to post their opinion. Hell even you post here with your controversal opinions yet you have yet to be penalized right?

The few good posts in any thread discussing this car (or any competitor for that matter) are always drowned out by the rabid fanbois that call themselves enthusiasts but are nothing more than badge whores.

See above. This applies to most brand oriented forums. Post your same statement about "fanbois" on clublexus and talk about Lexus in this manner. You know the deal I'm sure as you've recieved infractions for this in the past for this very thing. Bimmerfest is where it is at. We can actually have fun, state our opinions without the overzealousness on the part of the the bestowed.

[MarkR171]

Originally Posted by Stoutnj89

Bashing lexus again... HAHA.. If u don't want a headache, get a lexus...

You sure about that? Second major recall on the IS Model alone... Lexus/Toyotas having stellar reliability is a thing of the past.
http://www.detnews.com/article/20110...nd-IS-vehicles

Toyota recalls 1.7 million Lexus GS and IS vehicles
Fuel-pressure sensors can cause leaks

Toyota Motor Corp. is recalling nearly 1.7 million cars worldwide to check fuel-pressure sensors to prevent gas leaks, in the latest in a series of damaging recalls by the world's largest automaker.

Most of the affected vehicles, or nearly 1.3 million, are in Japan, but the recall also includes 245,000 Lexus GS and IS models sold in the United States, Toyota said Wednesday.

It said fuel pressure sensors connected to certain fuel delivery pipes — those with nickel- phosphorus plating — can loosen over time, allowing fuel to leak.




Sure, people will come in and say "I own an IS-F and it's been perfect for XX,XXX miles!" ...but I guarantee countless M3 owners can say the same thing, I know more than a few of them personally.

Besides, who buys a high end performance car based on reliability ratings? Get that car you like. Drive them both, get to know the pros and cons, and decide on your own. I personally hate the way the IS/IS-F looks so would never even consider it, but that's me.