[w00kiec00kie]

Originally Posted by EpicE92

^No i definitely can but i shit you not everyone of those cars have to many lines in common. All headlights look the same, the roundness of the car looks the same to me W.E maybe im crazy. I understand they are good performing cars, but its just sad that a ZR1 cant stomp on all of them and its a 1/4 of the price

and like
the hyundai and bmw both have 4 wheels
and like doors
and like
they're like the same.
omg

[Robert]

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[pmeloche]

Originally Posted by EpicE92

Why does everyone loves porsches SOO much they all look exactly the same unless its $200,000 and up. Ill prepare to be flamed but its the truth and you all know it. I never know whether its a carrera, cayman, targa 4s, carrera S, all look to similar in my eyes.

It's really not that difficult. The 911 is always a Carrera but with minor differences between trims. The C4 imply an AWD as opposed to the C2 which is RWD. The Targa has to do with the top IIRC. The S is the beefed up trim of a particular model. I think you can tell from the exhaust most of the time.

As for the differences between the Cayman and the 911 the rear half of the car really differ.

[EpicE92]

ALRIGHT ALRIGHT ALRIGHT. I don't need any more of everyone's rants about why they are so good this that and the other thing. Ive been in them a few times no crazy 1's like gt2's and what not. I really do like gt3s ,turbos, and gt2's. But other than that im sorry i cant find myself to like/ or want one . Bang for buck i just think that there are some better cars out there . The end. I'm not trying to come off mean im just simply putting in my .02

[Kenix]

Bang for the buck, yeah there are cars that will be just as fast as a base Carrera for half the price. 370z comes to mind, for example. But you still have to be driving a Porsche to get that special P-car appeal, both from driving it and simply owning it. I think it's quite magical.

And if you can't tell a Carrera from a Cayman...

[stickypaws]

Originally Posted by EpicE92

ALRIGHT ALRIGHT ALRIGHT. I don't need any more of everyone's rants about why they are so good this that and the other thing. Ive been in them a few times no crazy 1's like gt2's and what not. I really do like gt3s ,turbos, and gt2's. But other than that im sorry i cant find myself to like/ or want one . Bang for buck i just think that there are some better cars out there . The end. I'm not trying to come off mean im just simply putting in my .02

Well, at least you're being honest. That's worth a lot in my book. Understanding a P-car is an acquired taste, like fine food or wine. Sure there are cheaper thrills out there, but you can get hooked on this stuff easily once you spend some serious time with it.

Originally Posted by pmeloche

It's really not that difficult. The 911 is always a Carrera but with minor differences between trims. The C4 imply an AWD as opposed to the C2 which is RWD. The Targa has to do with the top IIRC. The S is the beefed up trim of a particular model. I think you can tell from the exhaust most of the time.

It's much more than trim. And knowing the difference esp with past models, takes some learning. There are many books written and yet only the factory knows for sure what's what. If you look at my car (see my earlier post) you'll recognize what it is if you know your stuff, but then there's something on it that throws it off (can you guess?)

And also something that this pic reveals, too

[gonzo]

^Exhaust?

I have maybe found the perfect P car for myself. Not being able to squeeze my clubs into one was a problem when considering. Taking the driver/3 wood out it would seem to accommadate the bag. Can you fill me in on the quirks, if any, with Targas.

A C4S Targa seems to have it all. A bit of utility if needed when opened and lay the seat backs down. All wheel drive and the S power. A hint of cabriolet. And that lovely wide rear.

So boring, indeed. I WANT one of these BORING cars.

Thanks.

[gonzo]

Here are the engine numbers for an 07.

ENGINE: 24 Valves,3.8L Flat 6 Engine,Double Overhead Cam,Max Hp: 355 Hp @ 6600 Rpm,Torque: 295 Ft-lbs. @ 4600 Rpm.


Something to be said about all the "new" cars. Quote from an article I read on the CS.

The all-wheel-drive R8 may be the media darling of the month, but it's the Porsche 911 Carrera S that has combined daily usability with ultimate performance for 40 years. It's the original everyday supercar, and it's still a kick.

Super indeed.

[stickypaws]

Originally Posted by gonzo

^Exhaust?

I have maybe found the perfect P car for myself. Not being able to squeeze my clubs into one was a problem when considering. Taking the driver/3 wood out it would seem to accommadate the bag. Can you fill me in on the quirks, if any, with Targas.

A C4S Targa seems to have it all. A bit of utility if needed when opened and lay the seat backs down. All wheel drive and the S power. A hint of cabriolet. And that lovely wide rear.

So boring, indeed. I WANT one of these BORING cars.

Thanks.

Yep, they're the RS version tips.

Nothing wrong at all with the Targa if you like them. I'd definitely take it over a cab if those were the two choices. They weigh about 140 lbs more; that glass is fairly heavy. (As a comparison the 997 Targa weighs 410 lbs more than my 993 C4S.) The suspension is a bit different on the Targa than the coupe due to the roof.

The 'tailgate' does give you some flexibility although it's still a bit difficult to lift something over the rear and into the backseat area. btw, a popular option on 911s is RSD. Rear seat delete. It shaves off a lot of weight. And nobody really wants to sit in those tiny seats anyway. I'm doing a RSD on my 993 as soon as I can find a used one available (around $3k new from the dealer!)

I have the same sort of roof (same technology) on my MB (glass pano roof.) It's nice to have but does add weight and makes it more top heavy. I personally wouldn't want it in a sports car, but if the Targa is going to be your DD, then you'll need to make compromises that suit your use and lifestyle. Nonetheless, it's the same ride as a coupe in the real world sense of things.

Why don't you buy that 964 that's sitting on the floor in your second batch of pics? p.s., looks like a 930 with RH wheels (?)

[Tony717]

the mirage gt in white =

[BillLee]

[gonzo]

sPaws.

If I was to look at a more retro car I have always been a fan of the 930. I can just stare at these. To me this just oozes class/heritage.

Here is an 87' with 40K miles. $39K. You keep the miles off 911's and they hold value like not many others. Don't these have 4 speeds or the first year to get 5? No air bags?

I am pretty hard on the gas/brakes. I would feel like I was going to break something....and pay out the nose.

Good source I use: http://www.carspecsdirectory.com/Porsche.htm

[stickypaws]

Originally Posted by gonzo

sPaws.

If I was to look at a more retro car I have always been a fan of the 930. I can just stare at these. To me this just oozes class/heritage.

Here is an 87' with 40K miles. $39K. You keep the miles off 911's and they hold value like not many others. Don't these have 4 speeds or the first year to get 5? No air bags?

I am pretty hard on the gas/brakes. I would feel like I was going to break something....and pay out the nose.

Good source I use: http://www.carspecsdirectory.com/Porsche.htm

You'd probably break your nose before breaking the bank.

Oversteer (and a short wheelbase) with that sort of power can be a deadly combo. And with the lag from turbos in those days, that kinda made it a "whoa, WTF?!" sort of ride. These cars stay planted when you use the throttle but it's not that easy when you aren't exactly sure when that boost is going to decide to kick in, esp if you aren't keeping the revs up. I think the 930 was when Porsche (USA) got their first wrongful death liability suits. Not easy to drive correctly and safely. The last year of production was fitted with a 5-speed.

A 964 Turbo makes more sense in the everyday world. And the 993 Turbo is really the ticket. Although prices are still pretty stiff for them; $60k on up and with really good specimens sometimes at $80k+

But the 993TT was one of the jewels of the air-cooled era. Smooth twin turbos. Very fast and fitted with AWD so as to keep those accidents down a bit.

btw, these cars are tough and pretty reliable. They need to be driven hard, you won't break anything. But when parts do wear out they are expensive. And don't forget those two filter, 11 quarts of Mobil 1 oil changes. And which consume a good 1 1/2-2 hours of your time to do--if you're quick at it

[gonzo]

That's why I like asking you! Probably a leg and an arm too. I will never have the knowledge on these rascals that you do. ADD does not help. "Sneak up on you" boost makes my skin crawl.

May I ask why the 96-98 993TT's are as high if not higher as some similar 2003/up cars?

Why is the air cooled car so sought after?

Thanks.

[gonzo]

Example:

1 owner car. 96 80K 17,000 miles. Then there are 03's with similar miles for under 60K.

I read that the 97-98 models have stronger transmissions than the 96 and the ECU is not locked.

[stickypaws]

Many reasons. Some are real and some totally subjective.

There were fewer 993s built than 996s and 997s. There were around 180 993 Turbo S versions built. I think about 6000 993 TTs total in the world (not certain about that.) Doesn't really mean anything in ownership, but when there's less of something good that's still around --well, you get the picture.

Air cooled engines sound completely different and smell different (seriously!) A plumbed engine means more weight and another liquid to worry about, imho. btw, the air cooled motors are really oil cooled. 11 quarts of oil in a separate tank (it's a real dry sump; ideal for track use.) You have an oil temp gauge, an oil level gauge, and an oil pressure gauge to keep an eye on things (and a long dipstick that measures the tank; you have to be on level ground with the motor running and completely warmed up; it takes a while to learn the sweet spot of your particular car so you don't under or over fill.)

Air cooled are part of the history of the best (imho) flat six designs ever produced. Nothing wrong with liguid cooled (needed to use newer engine technology and to keep within noise regulations in some jurisdictions.) The 959 had water cooled cylinder heads (as did other non-911 Porsches; 924/944/928, etc..)

The 993 was about 90% hand built. The 996 and later are mass produced. The 993 is more visceral feeling. It's you and the road. There is ABS and ABD but no other electronics to save you. The 996s and 997s have more sound dampening inside, electronics, and other comforts that make them easier to drive and a better DD. The 993s (and earlier) are raw but can be a DD if desired.

But they are getting older and really are best suited for a weekend sports car. And if you are somewhat careful with adding mileage and maintain it, you'll have something that actually holds value. But if resale doesn't matter, these cars are made to rack on the miles; so there's no harm at all in driving them a lot. They are very reliable.

They are OBDII from '96 onwards, but, yes one can flash the ECU of the '97s and '98s. The input shaft was beefed up after the first year since a lot of power was put down on the AWD with the blown motor. One should be really be careful about mods; and also disturbing the provenance of the car:http://www.993tt.com/mods/mods.htm

[Ender514]

i love them. they all look hot.

this has always been one of my favorite body styles:

[gonzo]

sPaws:

Why am I not surprised with the above response.

I read about a guy who was dumping his 997TT to go back to a 993. One of the reasons he mentioned was in fact the smell. He missed it. I think I get what that is all about.

Uncertainty abounds in work. This would be a splurge type purchase. The need to test drive a 993 is going to be hard to fullfill if things line up right, I would think.

I ran across a silver with red in immaculate condition. Low miles...asking 114K. If I am not mistaken isn't that above the original sticker of ANY 993TT? It was loaded with options, including the RSD. Gorgeous car. IF one was to find it's way to me the only mod would be some really classy wheels.

[Deda]

fantastic pics!

[gonzo]

I found that X50 I mentioned above. This has to be the perfect Porsche IMO. Also a serious reminder about these cars. Tree/Telephone pole 1. Driver 0.

1997 PORSCHE 993 TURBO X50

Arctic silver/Boxster red, 8,300 miles, factory X50/450 HP engine kit, sport seats w/ silver seat backs, factory Turbo S front spoiler and fog light/brake ducts, special full leather interior with complete carbon fiber package and 3-spoke steering wheel, CD, seat crests, factory infra-red alarm, sunroof delete, rear seat delete, rear wiper delete, Bilstein PSS-9 suspension with new BBS LM wheels and tires, clear bra, fresh service with updates, certificate of authenticity, as new condition, finest available, $114,500

[TwinTurboXI]

Gonzo, that 993 is beautiful.

[TwinTurboXI]

Some may not like the color,

to each his own, I love it.