[syslakm]

Originally Posted by Slyslap

lol your analysis of these two are so spot on.

I also agree.

Although not directed at this review, in the Lucid vs BMW video, I found it interesting that they had such detailed objective testing of the sound levels... and that was it...

No other objective information about 0-60 times or other standard performance metrics; nor any objective information about cabin volume, trunk volume, etc...

Just lots of videos of them drifting.

[Slyslap]

Originally Posted by syslakm

I also agree.

Although not directed at this review, in the Lucid vs BMW video, I found it interesting that they had such detailed objective testing of the sound levels... and that was it...

No other objective information about 0-60 times or other standard performance metrics; nor any objective information about cabin volume, trunk volume, etc...

Just lots of videos of them drifting.

I don’t understand why they were so focused on drifting? Sometimes they need to take a step back and figure out what the intentions of the car is before doing a deep dive. Usually they do a street drive and track, but If I recall correctly, this was a very track focused drive session.

[syslakm]

Originally Posted by Slyslap

I don’t understand why they were so focused on drifting? Sometimes they need to take a step back and figure out what the intentions of the car is before doing a deep dive. Usually they do a street drive and track, but If I recall correctly, this was a very track focused drive session.

Maybe it's because they had that racetrack rented out so they wanted to take advantage of it?

[footie]

Originally Posted by scas12

video was a waste of time to watch. I gave it a solid thumbs down.

Yeah complete A-holes. The i4M50 shares a lot with the i5M60 and its throttle response is superb, it’s like everything your brain adapts very quickly once you get a new car and find stuff like the throttle, clutch or brake pedal is different than before, these guys like what they like and if it ain’t like that well then it must be crap.

[CGG]

Sadly, I agree with the review. You can see the disappointment on their faces.

I have owned the last three generations of the 5 series - the E60 (man I loved that car), F10 and G30. The G60 has become a very heavy appliance. The E60 5 series weighed 3500 pounds. The G30 around 3750 pounds. The M60 weighs in at 3000 more pounds - an astounding 6500 pounds. A very competent appliance but an appliance nevertheless. Don't get me started on the looks of the G60.

Since I have owned the last three generations of 5 series I was highly anticipating the opportunity to get the new generation G60. It was like waiting for Christmas. I have been down to the dealership four times but I just can't bring myself to get one yet. Perhaps in time I will convince myself to get past my reservations.

[bmwterp]

Originally Posted by CGG

Sadly, I agree with the review. You can see the disappointment on their faces.

I have owned the last three generations of the 5 series - the E60 (man I loved that car), F10 and G30. The G60 has become a very heavy appliance. The E60 5 series weighed 3500 pounds. The G30 around 3750 pounds. The M60 weighs in at 3000 more pounds - an astounding 6500 pounds. A very competent appliance but an appliance nevertheless. Don't get me started on the looks of the G60.

Since I have owned the last three generations of 5 series I was highly anticipating the opportunity to get the new generation G60. It was like waiting for Christmas. I have been down to the dealership four times but I just can't bring myself to get one yet. Perhaps in time I will convince myself to get past my reservations.

All fair. But this along with all reviews of the I5 (esp the M60) are all subjective.

The issue I see over and over again is expectations. IMO the I5 is NOT a sports sedan. If this is what you place value on, then you are going to be disappointed.

The I5 is an electric luxury sedan. If you can manage the electric lifestyle, and you want something with great tech, comfort and refinement. It's an amazing car. I think the electric platform goes great with a luxury car. Not so much with a sports car.

[RichardInCA]

M60 is a big car, but it’s 5,250lbs not 6,500lbs.

[MrDit]

Originally Posted by RichardInCA

M60 is a big car, but it’s 5,250lbs not 6,500lbs.

Just to expand on this a bit, the curb weight is what the car actually weighs and is 5,247 pounds. The gross weight is 6,404 pounds which would include passengers and any cargo capacity.

[CGG]

Originally Posted by bmwterp

All fair. But this along with all reviews of the I5 (esp the M60) are all subjective.

The issue I see over and over again is expectations. IMO the I5 is NOT a sports sedan. If this is what you place value on, then you are going to be disappointed.

The I5 is an electric luxury sedan. If you can manage the electric lifestyle, and you want something with great tech, comfort and refinement. It's an amazing car. I think the electric platform goes great with a luxury car. Not so much with a sports car.

Well said.

[footie]

Originally Posted by CGG

Sadly, I agree with the review. You can see the disappointment on their faces.

I have owned the last three generations of the 5 series - the E60 (man I loved that car), F10 and G30. The G60 has become a very heavy appliance. The E60 5 series weighed 3500 pounds. The G30 around 3750 pounds. The M60 weighs in at 3000 more pounds - an astounding 6500 pounds. A very competent appliance but an appliance nevertheless. Don't get me started on the looks of the G60.

Since I have owned the last three generations of 5 series I was highly anticipating the opportunity to get the new generation G60. It was like waiting for Christmas. I have been down to the dealership four times but I just can't bring myself to get one yet. Perhaps in time I will convince myself to get past my reservations.

Funny how people’s perspectives on cars differ greatly, you loved your E60 yet when the brother own his E60 M5 we both hated it, couldn’t wait to see the back of it. His F10 M5 after it we both liked a lot but when I got my F90 M5 we each agreed it was by far the best M5, combining speed with a new found comfort never before.

The i5M60 isn’t a sports saloon in the true sense, it might be very capable of covering cross country and a serious lick of pace but due to its weight it’s never going to feel rewarding doing it. The M60 is a luxury car first and foremost with serious performance and a sports saloon a very distance second, accept this and I don’t think anyone will be disappointed with it.

The brother now drives the Taycan Cross Turismo 4S and I know lots of people love it but I ain’t one of them, it has some serious tramlinning going on down a back road plus the technology is very poor for something this expensive, when I owned my i4M50 had someone offered me to swap my car for a Taycan I would tell them to run and jump. At the moment I am yet to drive a better EV than what BMW offer.

[8GranCouper]

He hated the Ioniq 5 N too which was universally praised by people from Misha to Chris Harris to even Clarkson. When it comes to performance EV's I wouldn't take his opinion too seriously.

[Germanauto]

I got to autocross both the i5 and the 540xi at the UDE event. The i5 falls flat on its face. It's noticeably heavier and understeer-prone compared to the ICE model, which is remarkably balanced in comparison. The BMW driving instructors were in agreement.

The ICE version still suffers from numb and loose-feeling steering, but it is a far better driver's car than the EV model. The aural feedback from the lovely B58 is a delight as well.

As another poster alluded to, the i5 is a great luxury electric sedan, but no sport sedan. BMW's objective with the i5 was to enter the sedan segment with an EV and they did just that successfully.

[SouthTX210]

If you see their reviews through the lens of how they are so knowledgeable and superior to the car designers themselves, it will all quickly come into focus. 😉

[Blue Sky]

Its been a few months since I looked at that video, but I recall highlights. I’m keen to hear real criticism to be an informed consumer, but this video is useless and should just be ignored.

They clearly were against the car from the outset, and their goal was simply to find “evidence” of the i5 being bad. The throttle thing made no sense, and has been analyzed in detail in other posts elsewhere: somehow stomping and releasing the pedal with neck snapping results was considered “bad”, and poor “throttle filtering”. Immeidate throttle response is one of the holy grail of performance cars so its downright pretty silly to insist that a car neuter its performance for the sake of smootheness. Unless you want it to be so as a setting. Also, complaining about the car jumping a little when changing drivetrain modes also seems silly to me, since my F10 M5 with the twin-turbo V8 575 hp does exactly the same thing when I toggle Sport Plus mode (it tends to immediately charge ahead slightly while driving). Finally, all the driving I can recall is on some rural farm area with nothing but straight roads and 90 degree turns at 4 way intersections. Hardly useful for evaluating handling in turns.

[rgw]

The Savagegeese crew is pretty dismissive of EVs. Essentially they see EVs as transportation pods not driving machines. Jack is a huge BMW fanboy and it is a running bit how he shoehorns mentioning the B58 engine any possible opportunity.

I understand where they’re coming from but I think they’re also being uncharitable.

[8GranCouper]

Originally Posted by rgw

The Savagegeese crew is pretty dismissive of EVs. Essentially they see EVs as transportation pods not driving machines. Jack is a huge BMW fanboy and it is a running bit how he shoehorns mentioning the B58 engine any possible opportunity.

I understand where they’re coming from but I think they’re also being uncharitable.

The only EV they seem to really like and promote is the Lucid, probably because the company let them keep a pre-production prototype for 6 months. They compared it to the E39 which might be the most delusional thing I've ever heard.

[rgw]

Originally Posted by 8GranCouper

The only EV they seem to really like and promote is the Lucid, probably because the company let them keep a pre-production prototype for 6 months. They compared it to the E39 which might be the most delusional thing I've ever heard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtzgPltmVEM

The charitable read on that is “you learn to appreciate an EV with an extended time with it.” The less charitable and more likely true read is a bit concerning. Never actually watched those videos because their track record of being anti-EV precedes them.

[PeterC4]

I thought the Lucid review was quite good. They were straight forward about the strengths and weaknesses of the car and the benefits of its architecture. It’s a very roomy car inside. The real world range limitations under cold climate conditions at various travelling speeds was informative and disappointing to hear. Difficult for me to buy an all electric version of any brand at this time.

[Germanauto]

The Lucid is definitely superior handling, I've driven one out on Angeles Crest hwy.

With that being said, these guys overrated how "sporty" it is. It just drives like a comfortable luxury sedan that is competent handling (in a clinical way) when you want it to be. Sure the chassis is quite neutral, but there are sportier sedans out there.

Not to mention it looks like a Buick..

[Scrapula]

Originally Posted by PeterC4

I thought the Lucid review was quite good. They were straight forward about the strengths and weaknesses of the car and the benefits of its architecture. It’s a very roomy car inside. The real world range limitations under cold climate conditions at various travelling speeds was informative and disappointing to hear. Difficult for me to buy an all electric version of any brand at this time.

Kyle Conner got over 500 pure highway miles. Even if it loses 20% to cold, it’s better than any other vehicle out there. The one I drove definitely is a highway cruiser. It feels glued to the ground. Even though it’s quick, it seemed to have a slower ramp up to speed, not the neck snapping of the i5 M60. Very roomy and comfortable. Massaging seats. It feels more like an old person car, though. I’m 67 so it must be worse for younger people.

[Maverick241]

Originally Posted by 8GranCouper

The only EV they seem to really like and promote is the Lucid, probably because the company let them keep a pre-production prototype for 6 months. They compared it to the E39 which might be the most delusional thing I've ever heard.

I was going to point this out. For the most part SG, especially mark are not EV fans. They bash most of them and call them "disposable" cars. Except for Lucid. Good Lord they LOVE Lucid for some reason lol. I think it's because like you said they got a long term loaner and Lucid gave them pretty crazy access to their engineering team.

[8GranCouper]

Originally Posted by Maverick241

I was going to point this out. For the most part SG, especially mark are not EV fans. They bash most of them and call them "disposable" cars. Except for Lucid. Good Lord they LOVE Lucid for some reason lol. I think it's because like you said they got a long term loaner and Lucid gave them pretty crazy access to their engineering team.

I find it ironic how much he goes on about EV's being overpriced and disposable and going out of date quickly, while promoting a very expensive low-volume car from a startup that might not even be around in 5 years.

I don't mind if he likes or dislikes a car or has certain biases, but shilling something like this that goes against everything he claims to stand for just hurts his credibility really badly.