[chassis]

4Runner. Utterly reliable, comfortable, spacious and solid towing and 4x4 capability.

The 1GR-FE V6 has been in production for 20 years. That’s a complement to Toyota, and benefits the consumer.

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by thegump

This exact thing happened to my wife's 2018 overland with 26k miles right before a retreat to an icy cabin.. Safe to say we were blessed that it happened in town.

We traded it for a GX460 (which is what we wanted to begin with) and she absolutely loves it. It's from a different era but we haven't cared one bit.

Wild! Crazy to hear of another that's effectively identical. Ours let loose at like 38k? It was discovered when my wife was backing out of the driveway to go pick up groceries. When she got back she had said that "something didn't feel right." I hopped in for a quick run around the neighborhood to see what was going on and realized immediately. It was as if the center differential was locked when turning in the cul-de-sac. Tried turning the terrain selection knob thinking something got bumped and then it just locked me out. Had to tow from there. The dealer showed me the cracked open case and could see that lots let loose.

I'd be interested in hearing your opinions on the GX. Those have also been on my radar - just a fancy Land Cruiser Prado which is fine by me. Do you find it to be more refined and more options than that of the 4Runner? I'd venture to say no seeing your comment of it being from a different era

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by chassis

4Runner. Utterly reliable, comfortable, spacious and solid towing and 4x4 capability.

The 1GR-FE V6 has been in production for 20 years. That’s a complement to Toyota, and benefits the consumer.

That's what I'm saying! Whatever we buy I want it to be something that's here to stay. Last thing I want is to pay it off in a few years and the vibrating headrest feature takes a dump. I do want comfort, but we don't need all of the frills.

Features my wife does use that the 4Runner does not have - power rear hatch, remote start, and the keyless start. The brand new ones offer the push-button start, but earlier years are traditional key. Perhaps the GX mentioned earlier can find some middle ground but with the 4.6 instead of the 4.0.

[robertm]

I'd look at Toyota suvs and Hyundai/Kia. Toyotas are very reliable and the Koreans make a great looking product with an excellent warranty. If you can find a gently used one a year old with the depreciation hit already taken even better.

[DocL]

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

My company car is a 2020 Equinox and I've been really disappointed with the interior quality. I've had it since zero miles and the interior rattles started on the drive home. Albeit, it's a lower end trim like LT or something, but still. It's because of that that I haven't really considered anything GM. I like the looks of the Yukon as an example, but I'd hope for a little better quality. I say that with zero first hand experience with a Yukon...

I can see your trepidation on getting another GM vehicle. Our Chevy has had zero issues with interior noise and quality. It's also the first GM car I've ever owned. My only problem are the fucking hotwheels cars that are stuck in the seat tracks that are a PITA to get out.

[Machinebuilder]

The Kia Telluride is worth considering. Its nice looking, has a great warranty and its a car that wins all the comparison tests.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by stein_325i

Off topic but, how you liking the Alfa, considering adding one to my garage.

Handling is absurdly good, just ridiculous for a suv. Even compared to the benchmark X3, leaves it for dead.

I think it looks great.

Interior is beautifully simple and clean, note this is the Lusso trim so full leather dash and doors etc, no plastic.

Engine is a gem 280hp, gobs of torque and in sport mode, little to no lag

Negatives....Boot is small for class, too small for us tbh, the squarer shaped X3 was better for this.

Interior in general feels tighter than X3, just by a weee bit, likely the swoopy vs squarer roof line.

Active safety is appalling, now I have a hate on for all this shit but this car is chronic. Constantly beeping, hugely intrusive auto brake, absolutely loathe it.

Infotainment options are sparse and hard to use.

[Alfisti]

i HAVE LITERALLY NO IDEA WHY YOU'D GO THE LANDCRUISER/4 rUNNER AVENUE WITH MAYBE 2 KIDS, ABSOLUTE OVERKILL, nof FOR 4 RUNNER ... hIGHLander does it all in a far simpler and more comfortable package.

Too lazy to correct caps.

[bngcruiser]

By the way, I like your kitted out land cruiser and m2 pairing:

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

At this point I'm leaning pretty heavily towards a Toyota 4Runner TRD Off Road Premium or a used TRD Pro. The lack of depreciation, utterly proven reliability, and still some cool factor checks a few boxes.

Back in college, my wife had a 87 Toyota 4X4 that she loved dearly. She had Subaru wagons since 1999. She started paddle boarding in 2017 and grew tired of constantly strapping the board to the roof. Back in July 2020, we bought her a new 4runner TRD ORP with/moonroof (no other options). She can simply flip the back seat down, roll down the rear window, and slide the board in and drive to the lake. It's perfect and she absolutely loves having the 4runner.

List was $44K and we got it for $39K. She REALLY wanted the Pro because of the looks. I convinced that we could save a mountain of money by getting the ORP and when doing the Pro mods ourselves. She loved the idea of modding the truck with her own hands. Short of the Pro suspension, her ORP looks exactly like a Pro. We'll be adding Bilstein shocks all around which will give it close to the Pro ride and ride height. All in, we'll have spent around $45K on her ORP to make it look, drive, and sound like a Pro, which sells for around $50-51K and dealers don't budge on MSRP.

If you're going to get a 1 to 3 y/o 4runner, buy new. The resale is simply to high to justify spending so much on a used one.

As others noted, the 4runner is archaic compared to other SUVs in the same price range. The interior is full of hard plastic, the seats are fake leather (only the Limited and Night Shade get real leather), there is no auto climate control on ORP and below, there are no memory seats, there are no auto headlights, not until the 2021 did non-halogen headlights become available, the stereo speakers are mediocre, the thing handles and steers like the body on frame truck it is, it has high wind and tire noise, it has an ancient 5 speed LONG geared auto that is resistant to downshift, you have manually shift it into 4WD/LO, and it gets terrible mpgs (16-17 in the city, 19-20 highway at best). It is HUGE departure from my M235 and most any SUV/car I've rented in the past 5 years more in terms of amenities and materials.

With the negatives out of the way, I'm in love with it and drive it any chance I get. It looks the business. It's very well built and has legendary reliability. It rides surprisingly well. I'm almost 6' 2" and fit in it fine including the rear seat which does recline. There is WAY more rear cargo space than the 2015 Outback she formerly drove. I have a wife and two teenagers and we all fit in it fine with all our camping gear. I love the 4runner's simplicity. The aftermarket is endless. Parts are cheap and repairs/maintenance extremely easy. Everything comes a part and goes back together easily. Although it's largely plastic inside, the plastic doesn't scratch easily which is rare for a Japanese make. Other than a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon or greater, there is no other 4X4s available with the off road capability. The amount of 4WD modes and equipment is a bit overwhelming, but it's all tried and true and useful. I'll be doing new speakers and throttle enhancer to improve throttle/transmission response.

If you want something reliable, good looking, back to basics, and with real off road capability, the 4runner is a good choice. Otherwise, most may find it "cheap", old, and out classed compared to most other SUVs out there. After all, the current gen 4runner body and chassis has been around since 2010 and Toyota has only done minor exterior and interior updates.

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by robertm

I'd look at Toyota suvs and Hyundai/Kia. Toyotas are very reliable and the Koreans make a great looking product with an excellent warranty. If you can find a gently used one a year old with the depreciation hit already taken even better.

Originally Posted by Machinebuilder

The Kia Telluride is worth considering. Its nice looking, has a great warranty and its a car that wins all the comparison tests.

Great options! Seem like they have a lot for the price.

Originally Posted by Alfisti

i HAVE LITERALLY NO IDEA WHY YOU'D GO THE LANDCRUISER/4 rUNNER AVENUE WITH MAYBE 2 KIDS, ABSOLUTE OVERKILL, nof FOR 4 RUNNER ... hIGHLander does it all in a far simpler and more comfortable package.

Too lazy to correct caps.

I'm not sure I follow on the overkill. Is it size? They're all very similar.

4Runner trims in talk are only offered in a two row configuration whereas the Highlander is a three row. If you fold down the third row, it effectively has identical storage capacity behind second row (Highlander = 48ft³ / 4Runner = 47ft³). The 4Runner is far simpler than the Highlander. If anything, I would consider the Highlander overkill for two kids as it offers the third row. I won't argue comfort, however - unibody vs BOF always has a clear winner!

The Land Cruiser you may be thinking of is the GX460 that was brought up - which is a fancy Land Cruiser Prado - effectively same size with about 47ft³ behind second row.

I think they are all relevant and the choice comes down to use and lifestyle.

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by bngcruiser

By the way, I like your kitted out land cruiser and m2 pairing:

Excellent - looks like a nice 62! I've got a Collectors Edition 80 with the magic dial next to the steering wheel. She's a brute! Took her out in the national forest last weekend and have an extended camping trip for next weekend. Just keeps truckin'!

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

i HAVE LITERALLY NO IDEA WHY YOU'D GO THE LANDCRUISER/4 rUNNER AVENUE WITH MAYBE 2 KIDS, ABSOLUTE OVERKILL, nof FOR 4 RUNNER ... hIGHLander does it all in a far simpler and more comfortable package.

Too lazy to correct caps.

The question one needs to ask themselves is do they want a glorified wagon that's been butched up a bit or do they want a truck with wagon-like room.

Our 4runner has way more off-road capability than we'll ever need, but it's utility and storage meets our needs. The off-road capability is nice to have when we're on the fire roads in CO or the beaches of FL. Plus it looks the part and isn't trying to be something its not.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

4Runner trims in talk are only offered in a two row configuration whereas the Highlander is a three row. If you fold down the third row, it effectively has identical storage capacity behind second row (Highlander = 48ft³ / 4Runner = 47ft³). The 4Runner is far simpler than the Highlander. If anything, I would consider the Highlander overkill for two kids as it offers the third row. I won't argue comfort, however - unibody vs BOF always has a clear winner!

Don't do the 3rd row option on the 4runner. It's a waste unless your kids have no legs and it really kills rear cargo space and useful storage.

My son is 6', my daughter 5' 4", my wife 5' 8", and me at 6' 2". There's plenty of room for the four of us regardless of where each of us sits.

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

Back in college, my wife had a 87 Toyota 4X4 that she loved dearly. She had Subaru wagons since 1999. She started paddle boarding in 2017 and grew tired of constantly strapping the board to the roof. Back in July 2020, we bought her a new 4runner TRD ORP with/moonroof (no other options). She can simply flip the back seat down, roll down the rear window, and slide the board in and drive to the lake. It's perfect and she absolutely loves having the 4runner.

List was $44K and we got it for $39K. She REALLY wanted the Pro because of the looks. I convinced that we could save a mountain of money by getting the ORP and when doing the Pro mods ourselves. She loved the idea of modding the truck with her own hands. Short of the Pro suspension, her ORP looks exactly like a Pro. We'll be adding Bilstein shocks all around which will give it close to the Pro ride and ride height. All in, we'll have spent around $45K on her ORP to make it look, drive, and sound like a Pro, which sells for around $50-51K and dealers don't budge on MSRP.

If you're going to get a 1 to 3 y/o 4runner, buy new. The resale is simply to high to justify spending so much on a used one.

As others noted, the 4runner is archaic compared to other SUVs in the same price range. The interior is full of hard plastic, the seats are fake leather (only the Limited and Night Shade get real leather), there is no auto climate control on ORP and below, there are no memory seats, there are no auto headlights, not until the 2021 did non-halogen headlights become available, the stereo speakers are mediocre, the thing handles and steers like the body on frame truck it is, it has high wind and tire noise, it has an ancient 5 speed LONG geared auto that is resistant to downshift, you have manually shift it into 4WD/LO, and it gets terrible mpgs (16-17 in the city, 19-20 highway at best). It is HUGE departure from my M235 and most any SUV/car I've rented in the past 5 years more in terms of amenities and materials.

With the negatives out of the way, I'm in love with it and drive it any chance I get. It looks the business. It's very well built and has legendary reliability. It rides surprisingly well. I'm almost 6' 2" and fit in it fine including the rear seat which does recline. There is WAY more rear cargo space than the 2015 Outback she formerly drove. I have a wife and two teenagers and we all fit in it fine with all our camping gear. I love the 4runner's simplicity. The aftermarket is endless. Parts are cheap and repairs/maintenance extremely easy. Everything comes a part and goes back together easily. Although it's largely plastic inside, the plastic doesn't scratch easily which is rare for a Japanese make. Other than a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon or greater, there is no other 4X4s available with the off road capability. The amount of 4WD modes and equipment is a bit overwhelming, but it's all tried and true and useful. I'll be doing new speakers and throttle enhancer to improve throttle/transmission response.

If you want something reliable, good looking, back to basics, and with real off road capability, the 4runner is a good choice. Otherwise, most may find it "cheap", old, and out classed compared to most other SUVs out there. After all, the current gen 4runner body and chassis has been around since 2010 and Toyota has only done minor exterior and interior updates.

Great info!

Admittedly, I desperately love the Calvary Blue on the 2018 TRD Pros and would probably be the only reason I would opt for a Pro. As they are impossible to find, we can (as you have illustrated) buy a brand new ORP for the same price as a 3-4 year old Pro.

What are your thoughts on KDSS? Professor Google tells me it is most noticeable on the road which is where the majority of its time will be spent. Do you feel it is worth checking the expensive box?

I find the negatives of not having a lot of the features becoming a positive in the long run (and is a reason why they are so successful). If I am purchasing to hold for a long period, less can prove to be more. Seeing that the new ones offer some safety features is actually a bit of a downfall for me, but I do like the addition of a nicer infotainment with AA and Carplay integration. That said, a $500 headunit can take care of that on an older one...

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

Gotta hose out the Cheerios! I personally would love something like that, but I think you spend the money on something like that or a Wrangler to take the doors and top off - neither of which we'll do. And this is coming from someone that's owned many, many Wranglers (and Gladiator actually). I very rarely would take the doors off and never took the top off. Clearly we can always just leave them on...

I don't really plan to take the top or doors off much either, maybe the front sections that are small and light and easy to remove. From a pure utility standpoint though the value prop is tough to beat. New car warranty, looks really nice, get an extra set of steelies with winter tires. My only goal is a tank that can get me anywhere in any weather, mom lives on a nasty hill when we get snow it can be pretty dicey. Nice weather, throw the nephews in the back, if someone spills their Cheetos or gets car sick I can pull the drain plugs in the floor and literally hose the thing out.

Checks a lot of boxes plus isn't "too nice" so I can drive it when it's crap out, park downtown, etc.

[BEM-S4]

Here are some 4-door pics. I have a 2-door reserved and am waiting for a 2022. Thing looks really nice hopefully dealer demos will be avail soon to see in person.

[Vivek.]

In order of practicality:

My personal favorite 4Runner is the V8 that ended in 2009. Can be had in prime condition (ie, original owner, 50-75k miles which is the equivalent of 5-7k miles on anything else) for sub 20k and has the depreciation of a hundred dollar bill. Probably gets MPG within spitting distance of a new one for half the price and has more towing capacity to boot.

Audi Q5 was mentioned, my mom's got a 2010 Q5 Prestige that we've had since 2014 and now has around 115k on it. Has been solid needing only an expected suspension overhaul at 100k, couple oil leaks repaired, and some typical Audi interior plastics (sunvisor clips) over the course of 6 years/60k. Nice car with heated/cooled cupholders, generally decent amenities for a decade old car. Drives/handles great for an SUV.

Also if she wants an e90 m3, doesn't sound like the end of the world since you do have your LC if you absolutely need something bigger, which it sounds like most of the time you realistically won't. Do the rod bearings when you get it and as a 10-year-old BMW most common issues are documented, and they can be had in the low-mid 20's.

[Alfisti]

My issue with 4 runner overkill is unless you go offroad, Highlander does everything better.

BOF will never ride as well as a car platform and the 4 runner is seriously dated inside.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by spazzyfry123

What are your thoughts on KDSS? Professor Google tells me it is most noticeable on the road which is where the majority of its time will be spent. Do you feel it is worth checking the expensive box?

I can go either way on it. I haven't driven a 4runner with the option, but like you noted, most say it helps greatly with on-road driving, particularly body lean in turns. The KDSS system can be pricey to fix, but overall, it's still a reliable and simple system. It can complicate things if you were to ever do suspension mods. The $500 Bilstein shock setup I'll add soon will remove some of the sway/lean and the initial nose dive on braking. The shocks give the 4runner a more controlled and refined ride plus they lift the front an inch to level out the truck and make it match the ride height of the Pro.

I find the negatives of not having a lot of the features becoming a positive in the long run (and is a reason why they are so successful). If I am purchasing to hold for a long period, less can prove to be more. Seeing that the new ones offer some safety features is actually a bit of a downfall for me, but I do like the addition of a nicer infotainment with AA and Carplay integration. That said, a $500 headunit can take care of that on an older one...

I'm with you that fewer features can be a positive. I find the lack of auto climate control the most annoying lacking feature. The Pros come with auto climate control. My wife doesn't care at all though.

With the exception of radar cruise control, we have all the Safety Sense features turned off.

The 2020+ headunit is a huge step improvement over the prior systems, but like you noted, a new aftermarket headunit will be fine too. Probably the biggest advantage of getting a 2020+ 4runner is that the headunit controls are in the steering wheels and broadcast to instrument cluster. A $500 set of OEM+ speakers go a long way in fixing the sound quality of the stock system.

I think the 4runner is a great truck, but I am left to wonder why Toyota simply didn't throw an extra $100 into the ORP to give you memory seats, auto headlights, auto climate control, and one tap/3 flash turn signals. It seems so freaking easy, would update the truck, and are parts used on other Toyotas and in some cases, are standard features on the most basic of Toyotas. At $50K, the Pro is woefully overpriced. I even think $45K for what we've spent on our Pro-wanna-be is pushing it for the features/amenities you get. No vehicle is perfect though.

[4Hockey4]

I owned a Highlander few years back and we just drove the 4runner last weekend. 4Runner rides really good for 4x4. Also just got rid of a Honda CRV..both great cars and great resale.

You know why 4runner over Highlander for us ? Cause current AWD (apply to slip wheel crap over FT AWD of old) sucks, I've had a few recently...crap even in 3 inches of snow. Highlander nice ride, but just get the 2WD, pointless AWD IMO.

We want to go to mountains to ski..nope AWD brutal.

Grand Cherokee only slightly bigger inside, drove one of those too. Reliability not great on those. We also liked the base SR-5 better then limited. Steering etc too soft on limited.

(Don't know if you need/want 4WD or AWD, just my thoughts.)

[Alfisti]

I will never, ever, ever understand climate control. Ever.

I absolutely, positively LOATHE it.

Give me a knob that goes from cold to warm, it was so fucking simple. This is because it is not just about the temp in the car but the temp of the air coming into the car. On a cold day, i want slightly warm air or even some fresh air as the car can get stuffy. Instead, if the car is say 10 degrees and you have CC set to 18 degrees, it just blows crazy hot until the cabin gets to 18. Opposite applies on warm days.

Drives me fucking insane.