[Crimson92]

Originally Posted by anglo

$115k for a nicely loaded 911 Carrera S that has basically the same performance as an M4 made me say:

"F Porsche...I'm buying an M car"

Uhh you sure about that. The m4 gts has to work to keep up with a 991.2 s

[Crimson92]

Originally Posted by anglo

Well the gt3's msrp is $169k, the gt3 rs over $200k.

My favorite the 911R is at least $189k, some have been trying to sell it for ove $700k.

Where? In the states base gt3 is 135k

[zx10guy]

Originally Posted by dtwyim

Better than a recall notice.

I did get one of those. Still waiting for the mystical unicorn...err...replacement airbag.

[Crimson92]

Originally Posted by zx10guy

I did get one of those. Still waiting for the mystical unicorn...err...replacement airbag.

Same here.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by Crimson92

Uhh you sure about that. The m4 gts has to work to keep up with a 991.2 s

+1

The power numbers look similar, but the 911 Carrera S is easily 2x the sports car. The M4 is pretty fat and not as sharp - more of a GT car than sports car.

Given the 911 Carrera S has the same horsepower but weighs 300-400 lbs less than the M4 and has much more grip, it's much faster.

Is the Porsche good value for money? Probably not, but it's much faster and fun to drive than the M4 in every measurement.

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by Crimson92

Uhh you sure about that. The m4 gts has to work to keep up with a 991.2 s

When i was shopping for a 911 before i got the M4, the 991.2 wasnt available.
Yes, i'm sure about that. I said comparable performance.

The 991.2 just came out, the M4 is within .5 sec of it at Laguna Seca.

I doubt the M4 GTS has to work to keep up with a 911.2 S, it's within a second of the GT3 RS and quicker than a Ferrari Italia and Mclaren MP4 on the ring.

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by Z K

+1

The power numbers look similar, but the 911 Carrera S is easily 2x the sports car. The M4 is pretty fat and not as sharp - more of a GT car than sports car.

Given the 911 Carrera S has the same horsepower but weighs 300-400 lbs less than the M4 and has much more grip, it's much faster.

Is the Porsche good value for money? Probably not, but it's much faster and fun to drive than the M4 in every measurement.

50/50 is better than a rear engine setup,the 911's rear engine is a bad setup and the 911 relies on electronic nannies to achieve fast corner speeds. I like being able to drive my car fast with the electronics turned off.

It's not that much faster,the 991.2 runs the 1/4 in 11.8 even tho it weghs 300lbs less. Similar performance as an M4. No?

[Z K]

Originally Posted by anglo

50/50 is better than a rear engine setup,the 911's rear engine is a bad setup and the 911 relies on electronic nannies to achieve fast corner speeds. I like being able to drive my car fast with the electronics turned off.

It's not that much faster,the 991.2 runs the 1/4 in 11.8 even tho it weghs 300lbs less. Similar performance as an M4. No?

Not really, the 911, you can turn off all the electronic controls as well.

The weight distribution of the 991 C2 is now 42% front / 58% rear which is the same as the Ferrari 458 Italia. Other cars also known for great handling:
Lotus Elise: 38% front , 62% rear
Lotus Evora: 39% front , 61% rear
Now 50/50 is good, but who says its the optimal set up? These weight differences are very small.

As for quarter mile time, the M4 does 12.1 seconds which is still slower to the Carrera S's 11.5 seconds.

As for lap times, the difference is very big. Same driver, same track, very big difference in lap time.

Here it is on the Grand Tour track:
Rank Vehicle Driver Time PS / KG

5. Porsche 911 Carrera S Mike Skinner 1:21.40 420 / 1440
6. BMW M4 GTS Mike Skinner 1:22.40 500 / 1599
9. BMW M3 (F80) Mike Skinner 1:24.30 431 / 1520


Then Lightning lap with the older Carrera S:
2013 Porsche 911 Carrera S 2:58.9
2015 BMW M4 3:00.7

Then Nurburgring:
BMW M4 7:52.00
2017 Porsche 911 Carrera S 7:34

If you've driven them back to back, the M4 feels like you're driving a yacht compared to the tight Porsche.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by anglo

50/50 is better than a rear engine setup,the 911's rear engine is a bad setup and the 911 relies on electronic nannies to achieve fast corner speeds. I like being able to drive my car fast with the electronics turned off.

It's not that much faster,the 991.2 runs the 1/4 in 11.8 even tho it weghs 300lbs less. Similar performance as an M4. No?

What do you think about the 2017 Turbo-S ?
0-60 ? In Veyron time my friend !

I was passenger in one ...Holy shit it was fast and it scared the shit out of me in the rain !



It's on my list once my ///M is done..

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by Z K

Not really, the 911, you can turn off all the electronic controls as well.

The weight distribution of the 991 C2 is now 42% front / 58% rear which is the same as the Ferrari 458 Italia. Other cars also known for great handling:
Lotus Elise: 38% front , 62% rear
Lotus Evora: 39% front , 61% rear
Now 50/50 is good, but who says its the optimal set up? These weight differences are very small.

As for quarter mile time, the M4 does 12.1 seconds which is still slower to the Carrera S's 11.5 seconds.

As for lap times, the difference is very big. Same driver, same track, very big difference in lap time.

Here it is on the Grand Tour track:
Rank Vehicle Driver Time PS / KG

5. Porsche 911 Carrera S Mike Skinner 1:21.40 420 / 1440
6. BMW M4 GTS Mike Skinner 1:22.40 500 / 1599
9. BMW M3 (F80) Mike Skinner 1:24.30 431 / 1520


Then Lightning lap with the older Carrera S:
2013 Porsche 911 Carrera S 2:58.9
2015 BMW M4 3:00.7

Then Nurburgring:
BMW M4 7:52.00
2017 Porsche 911 Carrera S 7:34

If you've driven them back to back, the M4 feels like you're driving a yacht compared to the tight Porsche.

Car manufacturers use the ring as a benchmark, the M4 GTS is within a second of the GT3 RS. It's silly to say the M4 GTS has a hard time keeping up with the new 911 S.

The M4 has comparable performance, with a $3.5k coilovers and my M4 is better than the new 991.2 S. At some tracks like Laguna Seca they run similar times.

The 911 relies on PASM to be competitive, the other cars you mentioned have mid engines, longer wheelbase, having the engine behind the rear axle requires electronics to make it work.

Lightning laps is a joke, my friend. Lol

BTW,i ran the 1/4 with a 3,000 ft density altitude at 11.9 sec.some members here ran the 1/4 mile in 11.6 at sea level.


Sorry, i forgot, you go by car magazines and car shows with desk jockeys who cant drive.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by anglo

Car manufacturers use the ring as a benchmark, the M4 GTS is within a second of the GT3 RS. It's silly to say the M4 GTS has a hard time keeping up with the new 911 S.

The M4 has comparable performance, with a $3.5k coilovers and my M4 is better than the new 991.2 S. At some tracks like Laguna Seca they run similar times.

The 911 relies on PASM to be competitive, the other cars you mentioned have mid engines, longer wheelbase, having the engine behind the rear axle requires electronics to make it work.

Lightning laps is a joke, my friend. Lol

BTW,i ran the 1/4 with a 3,000 ft density altitude at 11.9 sec.some members here ran the 1/4 mile in 11.6 at sea level.


Sorry, i forgot, you go by car magazines and car shows with desk jockeys who cant drive.

Well, if you're desk racing, you use test numbers. You started it!

Real life swings both ways. I don't drag race, only track laps times are relevant for me. And I have driven both in real life on the track. Absolutely no comparison - the 2017 Carrera S is much more fun and nimble.

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by Z K

Well, if you're desk racing, you use test numbers. You started it!

Real life swings both ways. I don't drag race, only track laps times are relevant for me. And I have driven both in real life on the track. Absolutely no comparison - the 2017 Carrera S is much more fun and nimble.

With such a short wheelbase and the engine hanging behind the rear axle a la Corvair. That's why you need tons of electronics to make it work.
Even Porsche fanbois would agree the Cayman/Boxter is a more fun car to drive with a neutral handling.

At Laguna Seca both cars driven by Randy Pobst were within half a second, the 991.2 S vs the M4.you realize just getting the RE-71R's transforms the M4.

Watch the super Beetle with the racing stripes against an M4. You can see in the straights the gt3 was having a hard time pullin away from the base M4 and that's the top dog 911.

I don't know how you reached the conclusion tge 911 S is 2X the sports car.i've ran faster times around the track than a 991 s driven by a good driver.

You drove the 991s or 991.2s?

[PINeely]

Originally Posted by VRG_135

All I got was an email from Classic BMW........

I got a rock...

[CANGRKE70]

At least you got something...I got nothing from Parkview BMW and this is the second SUV I've bought from them

Classic Parkview BMW

[Lowflight]

Got the same thing the other day. What a waste of time and nice cardstock. Cadillac used to do that when I had my CTSV.

[Lowflight]

Originally Posted by PINeely

I got a rock...

[pz619]

All I got was a bill for the car payment. Jerks.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by anglo

With such a short wheelbase and the engine hanging behind the rear axle a la Corvair. That's why you need tons of electronics to make it work.
Even Porsche fanbois would agree the Cayman/Boxter is a more fun car to drive with a neutral handling.

At Laguna Seca both cars driven by Randy Pobst were within half a second, the 991.2 S vs the M4.you realize just getting the RE-71R's transforms the M4.

Watch the super Beetle with the racing stripes against an M4. You can see in the straights the gt3 was having a hard time pullin away from the base M4 and that's the top dog 911.

I don't know how you reached the conclusion tge 911 S is 2X the sports car.i've ran faster times around the track than a 991 s driven by a good driver.

You drove the 991s or 991.2s?

I don't see where your numbers are from... that's a HUGE difference in lap times - over 3 seconds slower per lap.

The M4 ran a 1:39.69 at Laguna Seca with Randy Pobst
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1038182

The 991.2 Carrera S is 136.44
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/mclar...t-drivers-car/

I drove the 991.2S. It was part of the Porsche event they were holding. It's absolutely beastly with the turbo engine. The 991 Carrera S was not bad but the 991.2 adds some major shove.

Have you driven the RE71R? That is more of an autocross tire than a track tire. It overheats very quickly and gets greasy. Not quite as bad as the POS Michelin PSS but the RE71R is only good for a few flying laps. I guess if you're going for a glory run, the RE71R is great for that. Nothing beats an R comp tire if you want pace.

[PoorLurker]

According to the logic in this thread.
Civic Type R > BMW M4

Let me know if you need the proof.

[MKSixer]

Originally Posted by anglo

Well the gt3's msrp is $169k, the gt3 rs over $200k.

My favorite the 911R is at least $189k, some have been trying to sell it for ove $700k.

Don't complain...

It could be a 918.

[The Choosey begger]

Originally Posted by Z K

I don't see where your numbers are from... that's a HUGE difference in lap times - over 3 seconds slower per lap.

The M4 ran a 1:39.69 at Laguna Seca with Randy Pobst
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1038182

The 991.2 Carrera S is 136.44
http://www.motortrend.com/cars/mclar...t-drivers-car/

I drove the 991.2S. It was part of the Porsche event they were holding. It's absolutely beastly with the turbo engine. The 991 Carrera S was not bad but the 991.2 adds some major shove.

Have you driven the RE71R? That is more of an autocross tire than a track tire. It overheats very quickly and gets greasy. Not quite as bad as the POS Michelin PSS but the RE71R is only good for a few flying laps. I guess if you're going for a glory run, the RE71R is great for that. Nothing beats an R comp tire if you want pace.

it's laughable to think the 991s or 991.2 s is 2x the sports car than an M4.

It's like saying the M4 is 2x the sports car than an E90 M3 because it obliterates the E90 M3 time of 8:05 around the ring by 13 seconds.

Randy Pobst ran a 1:39.30 in a 991 s (not the 991.2s). and 1:39.69 in an M4 at Laguna, they run the 1/4 mile in around 11.8 sec.

Yes you can say both cars have similar performance.
That's why i said F Porsche and got an M car, i didn't want to pay $40k more.
The 991.2 s wasn't out yet when i was shopping for a 911.


I'm on my 4th set of RE-71R's.

Was this Porsche event, an autocross event?

[InternetFame]

Originally Posted by PoorLurker

According to the logic in this thread.
Civic Type R > BMW M4

Let me know if you need the proof.

Call me crazy, but I plan on trading the Mini for one of those in a few years once the lease runs out on the F80 and it no longer becomes the daily. I am intrigued by it! Hoping they release more info on it, soon. Fantastic little hatch!