[G30M]

Originally Posted by NYG

You like Tesla apparently.

I've ordered a Kia EV6

[NYG]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I think Fer has potential for sure, but RB really brought nothing in terms of upgrades for the 2H of the season and their X factor is Max. No one on the grid is at his level. I think that these cars require a driver that can put in cracking laps, but managing the tires is just as important and here again Max is in a league of his own.

100% with you.

But a driver like Charles in the potential powerhouse that is the 2023/2024 Ferrari will not be easy to beat.

I'm confident in RBR and Max continuing his streak but I know there's an animal inside of that Ferrari that is waiting to be uncaged.

[G30M]

Originally Posted by NYG

You like Tesla apparently.

both the Tesla Model 3 and the Kia EV6 destroy the M340i when driving around my extremely hilly town.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by NYG

100% with you.

But a driver like Charles in the potential powerhouse that is the 2023/2024 Ferrari will not be easy to beat.

I'm confident in RBR and Max continuing his streak but I know there's an animal inside of that Ferrari that is waiting to be uncaged.

I agree re: Charles and the car potential. I like him and Sai as well but at this point I am all in for Max as I simply want to see everything with Ham next to it destroyed by Max as far as records go.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I agree re: Charles and the car potential. I like him and Sai as well but at this point I am all in for Max as I simply want to see everything with Ham next to it destroyed by Max as far as records go.

Yep, I'm here for the Verstappen train above all else. I just know RBR didn't have 10 years to prepare the next gen car the way Merc did for the previous generation so it won't be as easy to dominate.

For the first time in a while, I'll have a 2nd driver that I actually root for in F1 next year (Logan Sargeant) because Murrica.

[NYG]

73 wins and 6 world championships so far.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by NYG

73 wins and 6 world championships so far.

Combined still less than HAM alone.

[NYG]

Originally Posted by minn19

Combined still less than HAM alone.

Give it time.

[minn19]

Originally Posted by NYG

Give it time.

I thought that would get you going.

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by G99M5

Max could have let Sergio through in lap one and remain at 14 W but it was the other way round instead, forcing Sergio to ruin his tyres with some crazy tactic of following within DRS range of Max with nowhere to go.

i don't believe for a second that RB in all their high IQ personnel and catering staff had not found any way to get Sergio a WDC P2
in other words, lap 1 has been choreographed, Sergio has been told not to fight, Max gets his reco- I mean win, and a crazy strategy that left Sergio hung out to dry.

meanwhile, go Charlie!!!

Sure . But was Checo 100% fast enough to win this race ?
That was very doubtful for the Red Bull team and they wouldn't take that risk .
On the other hand : MAX was fast enough to win 15 races in this season ..

MAX was always driving in clean air , that was better for his tires while Checo ran through his tires behind MAX .

It was very clear that MAX slowed down to give Checo DRS to make a bigger gap to Charlie .
But Checo wasn't able to hang on , and MAX's kept his tires fine in the clean air .
Checo could have made it with one pitstop , but his tires would be completely gone .
IMHO .For Checo there was no other choise .

Congrats for Charlie's P2 , he was the whole season faster than Checo anyway .

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by NYG

Max probably has THE MOST DOMINANT karting legacy of all time.
The only people that pretended like Max wasn't going to dominate F1 were terribly biased.

BBC documentary of 2015 (± 11 mins):

One of the best karting circuits worldwide is located in Genk (Belgium), about 15 minutes away from Verstappen's Belgian house where he was raised. Several F1 drivers have raced that circuit during their karting days. Verstappen spent most of his karting training there. Long-time circuit owner Paul Lemmens witnessed the rise of Verstappen from his earliest days in karting until he entered F1. Here is what he said in a 2015 interview:

"Actually he won everything he could win. And even more incredible, during his final year in karting, he won in two categories, which is, as such, an extraordinary feat. After he finished in one category he stepped over into another one and won. Phenomenal. Actually incredible. I don't know the number of laps that Max has driven here, but it must have been thousands. But first and foremost because the kid liked it. And Jos [Verstappen] also got involved. Every free day, every free school day, every vacation: they were here from morning till evening, driving all the time. Once that he had learned the tricks of the trade, he was virtually invincible, except for mechanical failure. But otherwise... And if he encountered mechanical failure he simply drove from the back to the front. We have a lot of known people, like Alonso, Fisichella, of course his father Jos [Verstappen], all who are in Formula 1: [Michael] Schumacher, also [Jérome] d'Ambrosio started here, [Jenson] Button. All those names. I have known them all since they were still very young kids. Performing at that age what Max has done ? Well, I have nowhere seen this nor ever encountered, no. Jos [Verstappen] has driven here and he was also a very gifted pilot. But Jos [Verstappen] will not blame me if I say that I think that Max is better, haha. And if you have a dad with the package of having already karting and Formula 1 experience: that's an incredible asset for Max. If he gets into a good team, then this man will be world champion. That's a certainty."

FIA 2013 championship: Max Verstappen (kart #24) versus Charles Leclerc (kart #34) - 15 year old kids fighting at the Genk circuit for ± 20 mins:

[G30M]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Sure . But was Checo 100% fast enough to win this race ?
That was very doubtful for the Red Bull team and they wouldn't take that risk .
On the other hand : MAX was fast enough to win 15 races in this season ..

MAX was always driving in clean air , that was better for his tires while Checo ran through his tires behind MAX .

It was very clear that MAX slowed down to give Checo DRS to make a bigger gap to Charlie .
But Checo wasn't able to hang on , and MAX's kept his tires fine in the clean air .
Checo could have made it with one pitstop , but his tires would be completely gone .
IMHO .For Checo there was no other choise .

Congrats for Charlie's P2 , he was the whole season faster than Checo anyway .

if I were Sergio I'd be very worried. Sergio wants a car like how Jenson Button likes them ...

whereas Ricciardo's preferred car setup is like Max ... so if RB needs a faster driver they might just sneak Ricciardo in to be their number 2 ...

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium

Sure . But was Checo 100% fast enough to win this race ?
That was very doubtful for the Red Bull team and they wouldn't take that risk .
On the other hand : MAX was fast enough to win 15 races in this season ..

MAX was always driving in clean air , that was better for his tires while Checo ran through his tires behind MAX .

It was very clear that MAX slowed down to give Checo DRS to make a bigger gap to Charlie .
But Checo wasn't able to hang on , and MAX's kept his tires fine in the clean air .
Checo could have made it with one pitstop , but his tires would be completely gone .
IMHO .For Checo there was no other choise .

Congrats for Charlie's P2 , he was the whole season faster than Checo anyway .

After what was said on the radio before it was unlikely that Max would hold back more than he was doing to stop Chas and risk contact so Checo could catchup, in any case the drs ding dong with HAM then the GAS and ALB exchange was Checo's downfall holding him up to slip to third in championship and Max's suspicion of what happened at Monaco was quite strong, something a lot of the many virgin fans that were booing failed to understand.
There's nothing to stop Checo continuing in RB and I can't see him leaving as both have made up and if he believes he did nothing wrong at Monaco except for a brain storm at a critical moment then Ricciardo will remain as a third/extra reserve/PR man for RB.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by G99M5

if I were Sergio I'd be very worried. Sergio wants a car like how Jenson Button likes them ...

whereas Ricciardo's preferred car setup is like Max ... so if RB needs a faster driver they might just sneak Ricciardo in to be their number 2 ...

Perez may perceive the hiring of Ricciardo as 3rd driver for RBR as a real threat that he is required to provide maximum performance: if Perez underperforms in Spring 2023 (compared to Ricciardo test drive results) or makes a couple of mistakes during early 2023 race weekends, places 2-3 could be swapped mid-season.

Remember Kvyat in May 2016: abruptly replaced by Verstappen during the season (but that was also because Mercedes and Ferrari were entertaining the idea of hiring Verstappen for 2017 or later).
https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/36206848.amp

Also on a personal level, Ricciardo and Verstappen get along very well.

After the 2022 Abu Dhabi race last weekend:

Hard to imagine a bromance like this between Verstappen and Perez:

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Perez may perceive the hiring of Ricciardo as 3rd driver for RBR as a real threat that he is required to provide maximum performance: if Perez underperforms in Spring 2023 (compared to Ricciardo test drive results) or makes a couple of mistakes during early 2023 race weekends, places 2-3 could be swapped mid-season.

Remember Kvyat in May 2016: abruptly replaced by Verstappen during the season (but that was also because Mercedes and Ferrari were entertaining the idea of hiring Verstappen for 2017 or later).
https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/36206848.amp

Also on a personal level, Ricciardo and Verstappen get along very well.

Someone said that Ricciardo likes Max's oversteer set up too, if that's the case then if I were Max I would be slightly worried should Checo choose to leave and be replaced by Dan who, with no championships and his Monaco pit stop tire holdup with RB then the kick hole in wall out of frustration and with just a few GP wins could be a problem for him.
If I were Max I would probably have kept it to myself and let things continue as they are with a relatively easy run to a third championship only worrying about Ferrari but that's just my two cents.

[M5Rick]

[///M Power-Belgium]

Originally Posted by G99M5

if I were Sergio I'd be very worried. Sergio wants a car like how Jenson Button likes them ...

whereas Ricciardo's preferred car setup is like Max ... so if RB needs a faster driver they might just sneak Ricciardo in to be their number 2 ...

Won't happen in 2023 . Let's first see what he can do at Red Bull as the third driver in the 2023 Red Bull car ..
Knowing RIC was always beaten by Lando at McLaren .
RIC drove the whole 2022 season far below his normal level because he couldn't adapt the MCL36 McLaren car .
Finally RIC got psychological help , but it didn't helped him in his race results .
RIC is a great guy , but I'm pretty sure that he lost it ...Too bad !

I would love to see the Hulk (Nico-Hulkenberg) or Kmag (Kevin-Magnussen) as the second Red Bull driver on MAX's side .
Checo is a great driver , but he Isn't fast enough .
Red Bull needs a another fighter , another Lion just like MAX .

[GuidoK]

Hulkenberg would be a good match.
They are friends; Max probably knows Nico as long as he can remember, from the karting scene.
Hulkenberg can also adapt quickly to different cars. (won Le Mans on his 1st attempt).
But of course next year Nyck de Vries is driving for AT. That could be a good step up to 2nd driver at RB.

[M5Rick]

Originally Posted by G99M5

if I were Sergio I'd be very worried. Sergio wants a car like how Jenson Button likes them ...

whereas Ricciardo's preferred car setup is like Max ... so if RB needs a faster driver they might just sneak Ricciardo in to be their number 2 ...

I don't think Checo is worried one bit about his seat, not for '23 at least (so long as he doesn't admit on purpose Monaco shunt haha) what has hit him is getting carried away on that yacht after Monaco win and the very near miss from the wife

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by G99M5

it's completely pointless arguing about who is better than who - you need to put them all in the same car and then you'll see the real ranking

P4 and P6 are on the same team: unrestricted access at the same moments of an F1 season at the same tracks to identical car/engine/race packages, technology (hardware, software, know how), infrastructure and (training) facilities, briefings and people (engineers, mechanics, strategists and bosses).

Only differences: salary (almost 10:1), team experience, personal choice about preparation (training, race set-ups and race strategies), team orders, skills & experience, size & weight and age (a major age difference matters: for a top athlete, being approximately 12 years older has the benefit of having tons of additional experience and notoriety on track, but has the disadvantage of an ageing body required to perform under extreme conditions).

Same goes for P1 and P3 as well as for P2 and P5 (except for major differences in age and salary).

[NYG]

Originally Posted by GuidoK

Hulkenberg would be a good match.
They are friends; Max probably knows Nico as long as he can remember, from the karting scene.
Hulkenberg can also adapt quickly to different cars. (won Le Mans on his 1st attempt).
But of course next year Nyck de Vries is driving for AT. That could be a good step up to 2nd driver at RB.

I think Nico has proven that he's incapable of reaching the top tier. He's very good but has never seized any opportunity for big results. Magnussen is much more capable.

[EdM5]

Originally Posted by minn19

Combined still less than HAM alone.

True but these are the RB wins only.
Seb has had a few Ferrari wins as well.