[Ezio]

ehhhh

[TunedM2C]

Seeing how they're going after the M3/M4 with comparable pricing, I'd still take the M over this every time.

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

You have to put in the time to correct that misconception before you can just walk up next to the competition and say "see? we're the same because we have the same price tag!". It's going to take some time for that to change and until that happens they will need to undercut the competition. That's very hard to do when you're the same price, regardless of horsepower figures.

I love our Grand Cherokee because it offers the best VALUE in the segment. Cadillac should be doing the same in the luxury segment. The company needs to realize how badly they had sucked for the last 30 years before they get cocky about what they're producing currently. The impact of those decades of dreck are going to take a little more than 3-4 years to shake, which is where we are now.

Think about the "Jap-crap" reputation that Honda/Toyota used to have in the 70s and 80s. It turned around but it took time, lots of time.

It's a fine line to tread when you do value. If it is priced too cheaply, you get associated with the second-tier brands( Lincoln, Acura, Volvo, etc) and is very hard to move up once established there. But I do agree that they can't demand German money. I think the CTS is priced correctly. Still within the ballpark of its mid-size Germans, but still ~$5K cheaper. The ATS is harder to price due to the threat of vehicles from the lower luxury brands. Can't be too much cheaper than the 3 series or else the ATS is associated with the value minded luxury brands.

Up until the latest generation of vehicles, that is what Cadillac was doing. That was what the CTS was all about. Get a mid-size luxury vehicle for 3 series money. Now the CTS went up to the 5 series and ATS with the 3, 2nd gen owners are leaving to the mainstream brands. If Cadillac was happy with the value minded crowd, that is great, but they aren't and GM has Buick to play that game. Cadillac wants the image crowd which demands good marketing, dealer experience, etc. Have to sell the Cadillac lifestyle, which they suck horribly at right now.

[Mingwan]

Hmm, tough. Personally, the coupe would definitely be out of the question for purchasing. You're better off getting a corvette in my opinion. And in so many ways does it look horrible. The sedan looks much better. A little too flamboyant in my opinion in certain areas. I really feel like Cadillac is in the middle of an identity crisis. They should stick to more elegant styling rather than going for this semi-aggressive look which really makes some of the parts on the car seem aftermarket. That's just me, though. In the end, I'd probably just buy a loaded m3 and be content with paying the additional money. It seems like a more consolidated car.