[stevehecht]

I trust the guy. His company will work out whatever glitches there are.

Elon Musk Defends Tesla After Getting A Terrible Review

The Huffington Post | By Alexander C. Kaufman
Posted: 08/01/2014 1:05 pm EDT Updated: 08/01/2014 1:59 pm EDT




Elon Musk stammered out a hasty defense of Tesla’s Model S Thursday night, two days after facing blistering criticism over the car's maintenance problems.

A 17-month review of the $105,005 sedan, published this week by car-critic Edmunds.com, yielded one chief complaint -- parts of the car needed to be replaced too frequently. Tesla's chief executive countered the critique, saying the electric carmaker's Formula 1-trained service teams were overattentive, swapping out parts that had even the potential to be faulty.

“This maybe ended up being counterproductive, but the service team was ultra proactive with the Edmunds car, so they were doing their best to make Edmunds happy,” Musk said during an hour-long call with analysts after announcing the company's second-quarter earnings. “Unfortunately that resulted in them changing things out just on the off-chance that something might go wrong.”


Among the most serious complaints: The driver side door automatically opened just a crack when the car shifted into park. The sunroof wouldn’t open. The tires wore out prematurely. The vanity mirror hinge cracked and the touch-screen froze at one point. Twice, the car died on the roadside, requiring separate replacements of the drive unit and battery.

Regardless, Musk said, the model driven by Edmunds' drivers was old. Tesla continuously tweaks its vehicles -- from updating software to shaving “a few hundred pounds” off the body of the Model S since its inaugural edition -- and cars produced in the last year have outgrown the glitches that Edmunds’ drivers experienced.

“There were definitely some genuine issues, but they had one of our early production units,” Musk said. “In fact, most of the problems they encountered are not present in our current cars.”

Edmunds concluded that the car was “hard to recommend,” largely because the battery-charged drive unit, which powers the car in lieu of a combustion engine, was replaced three times -- once when the car died roadside, twice for suspicious noises. Musk blamed the latter two re-installments on his service department’s overkill.

“We take these actions with the customer’s convenience and satisfaction top of mind and strive to go above and beyond the expected level of service,” Alexis Georgeson, a Tesla spokeswoman, said in a statement to The Huffington Post on Friday. “In addition and as we would with any owner, we also paid an unusual amount of servicing attention to the Edmunds car because it was under warranty, meaning we were able to make the improvements and deliver a high level of service to the customer at no extra cost.”

On Thursday, Tesla posted a second-quarter loss of $62 million, double what it lost in the same period last year, as the company upped spending to expand its reach in China and develop its next-in-line Model X. Earlier on Thursday, Tesla announced a deal with Panasonic to build its Gigafactory, a plant that will mass produce the lithium-ion packs that power its cars.

Though states are still competing to attract the roughly $4 billion factory, Musk confirmed that the company broke ground on a preliminary site in Reno, Nevada.

Before moving on to the next question, Musk -- who publicly walloped the New York Times over a flawed negative review of the Model S last year -- leaped in on the call to stump for the car once more.

“We’re going to be at it hardcore,” he said, “until our car is 10X better than any other car on the road.”

[Venom]

Interesting article. Thanks for sharing!

[MikeyV]

The Edmunds reviews is pretty similar to several people I know in Norway who own them, they are garage queens. The big problem in Norway is there aren't many dealers, if you have a problem with your car it has to be trucked to the closest dealer, which is often 3-400km away.

[aas5]

Originally Posted by MikeyV

The Edmunds reviews is pretty similar to several people I know in Norway who own them, they are garage queens. The big problem in Norway is there aren't many dealers, if you have a problem with your car it has to be trucked to the closest dealer, which is often 3-400km away.

I don't think there are any dealers, period. Teslas are sold by the company directly so you have to go to the company owned store to get it fixed.

I never really considered a Tesla before but I was very surprised when a coupe of BMW track drivers told me they haven't seen a better car when I was picking up my BMW at the Performance Center. I even asked them about the i8 and they told me Tesla performed much better. I am definitely taking a look at a Tesla when my lease is up.

[ddk632]

Originally Posted by aas5

I never really considered a Tesla before but I was very surprised when a coupe of BMW track drivers told me they haven't seen a better car when I was picking up my BMW at the Performance Center. I even asked them about the i8 and they told me Tesla performed much better. I am definitely taking a look at a Tesla when my lease is up.

Hey man,

BMW Performance Center instructors told you the Tesla performs much better on a track than the i8? Or just "in general"?

(They aren't really comparable cars to begin with, btw.)

I've lurked some Tesla threads and the model S will do about 3-4 laps on a racetrack before it goes into reduced power / power conservation mode. Meaning, it will not have the full performance after a very short time on the track. This is due to battery/system heat running at max power for extended periods and for self-preservation, I believe.

Same with the i8; it's not a track car and will do maybe a couple of laps before going to reduced power. In fact, the i8 electric motor is designed to only provide full system power in bursts for a maximum of 5 seconds at a time.

Neither the i8 nor the Tesla are designed for track performance.

On the road, I doubt the real world difference in acceleration will be noticeable, be it 0-60 or in-gear acceleration, both the Model S and the i8 are seriously fast enough from everything I've read. That being said, due to lower weight and COG I would expect that the i8 handles in a different league than a Model S (as it should, since it's not a 5+2 seater sedan.)

Just saying that comment really threw me off, particularly if it was by a BMW PCD Instructor.

[Efthreeoh]

Did we expect Elon not to defend a shitty review of the Tesla?

I particularly liked this:

“We take these actions with the customer’s convenience and satisfaction top of mind and strive to go above and beyond the expected level of service,” Alexis Georgeson, a Tesla spokeswoman, said in a statement to The Huffington Post on Friday. “In addition and as we would with any owner, we also paid an unusual amount of servicing attention to the Edmunds car because it was under warranty, meaning we were able to make the improvements and deliver a high level of service to the customer at no extra cost.”

Sooooo, when it's out of warranty, the Customer is SOL?

[aas5]

Originally Posted by ddk632

Hey man,

BMW Performance Center instructors told you the Tesla performs much better on a track than the i8? Or just "in general"?

(They aren't really comparable cars to begin with, btw.)

I've lurked some Tesla threads and the model S will do about 3-4 laps on a racetrack before it goes into reduced power / power conservation mode. Meaning, it will not have the full performance after a very short time on the track. This is due to battery/system heat running at max power for extended periods and for self-preservation, I believe.

Same with the i8; it's not a track car and will do maybe a couple of laps before going to reduced power. In fact, the i8 electric motor is designed to only provide full system power in bursts for a maximum of 5 seconds at a time.

Neither the i8 nor the Tesla are designed for track performance.

On the road, I doubt the real world difference in acceleration will be noticeable, be it 0-60 or in-gear acceleration, both the Model S and the i8 are seriously fast enough from everything I've read. That being said, due to lower weight and COG I would expect that the i8 handles in a different league than a Model S (as it should, since it's not a 5+2 seater sedan.)

Just saying that comment really threw me off, particularly if it was by a BMW PCD Instructor.

I was very surprised to hear that but they told me that the i8 from a handling perspective was light years ahead of any BMW. I would have never expected to hear that from a BMW guy talking to me at the PC grounds but that's what was said. He made that point after I got out of doing a couple of quick laps in an M5 with an instructor...I haven't driven an i8 yet so can't really compare.

[ddk632]

Originally Posted by aas5

I was very surprised to hear that but they told me that the i8 from a handling perspective was light years ahead of any BMW. I would have never expected to hear that from a BMW guy talking to me at the PC grounds but that's what was said. He made that point after I got out of doing a couple of quick laps in an M5 with an instructor...I haven't driven an i8 yet so can't really compare.

Wow, that's crazy. That is such a strong superlative statement, "haven't seen a better car [than the Tesla]," that it needs qualifying, I think. I guess I need to drive a Tesla to see what is the fuss all about.

I also haven't driven an i8 yet, unfortunately; though, not many people have.

How did you like your PCD overall, and your new X6M?

[W///]

I don't understand. So because it was an Edmunds car, they paid more attention to it? I know it's kind of inevitable, but I would have thought it would be anonymous if a car was in a long term fleet.

The problem with these is that the closest store is over 2 hours away last time I checked, in a different state from me, completely impractical.

[MikeyV]

Originally Posted by aas5

I don't think there are any dealers, period. Teslas are sold by the company directly so you have to go to the company owned store to get it fixed.

I should have said service centre.

Originally Posted by aas5

I never really considered a Tesla before but I was very surprised when a coupe of BMW track drivers told me they haven't seen a better car when I was picking up my BMW at the Performance Center. I even asked them about the i8 and they told me Tesla performed much better. I am definitely taking a look at a Tesla when my lease is up.

I simply do not believe a Tesla is a better handling car than any BMW, well maybe the 2 series sport activity van thingy. They are simply too heavy.

[aas5]

It is hard to judge Tesla without driving one. May be I will go out for a test drive one of these days but I am not even sure if it's easy to arrange in NY/NJ (I think NJ banned them, right?).

My PC delivery went fine, it was a second time for me and we were in a rush to get back to NYC so only did the course drive and skipped the off road drive and the museum was closed. It was nice to see another x6M (red) being picked up there at the same time as ours.

The car is fantastic and a joy to drive. The power delivery is faster than in my previous 5.0 (as expected) and I love switching the M mode on every time I need to move a little bit faster

[ddk632]

Nice!

Enjoy her...



If you drive the Tesla, let us know what you think. I might do the same sometime soon.

There's a Tesla store - get this - in the Boca Raton (FL) Town Center mall, as in, inside the mall.

Maybe they do test drives inside the mall, haha!

[ShocknAwe]

There were things going wrong on that car that should never go wrong on any car made since 1950. Rearview mirrors cracking? Right.

I'm not surprised Mr. Musk came back to defend his brand at all. If he didn't it would have been catastrophic.

[///M5Driver]

My neighbor has the P85+ model with about 20k on it now (daily driven) and hasn't had a single issue with the car so far. Funny story too, they weren't able to put on the factory spoiler prior to delivery so they flew a representative out to his house to put it on the car at a later date.

The wife really wants an S too... they are amazing cars however I just cannot get over something so good looking that doesn't make any noise lol.

[NickyC]

The cars are going to have horrific resale values once word gets out the drive units start humming like crazy at certain speeds and need to be replaced, often. This is not a case of "most of the problems they encountered are not present in our current cars", it's continually happening with new cars and new owners. I like how Musk hedged that statement, "most of the problems". He's learning to distort the truth really well just like his buddy in the White House.

Him and Tesla will be fine however. Just as long as there is a government in power that will pull out all the stops to herald at least one "green" winner. It won't matter how many tax payer dollars, bailouts, or lies and half truths it will take to make it happen.

[///M5Driver]

Originally Posted by NickyC

The cars are going to have horrific resale values once word gets out the drive units start humming like crazy at certain speeds and need to be replaced, often. This is not a case of "most of the problems they encountered are not present in our current cars", it's continually happening with new cars and new owners. I like how Musk hedged that statement, "most of the problems". He's learning to distort the truth really well just like his buddy in the White House.

Him and Tesla will be fine however. Just as long as there is a government in power that will pull out all the stops to herald at least one "green" winner. It won't matter how many tax payer dollars, bailouts, or lies and half truths it will take to make it happen.

I can't say your assumptions contributed to this thread whatsoever.

There is always risk in brand new product but it's nice to see no matter what the failure Tesla without question has fixed the Edmund's vehicle. Also to counter your resale statement, Tesla's have a guaranteed resale value.

[NickyC]

Originally Posted by e46beater

I can't say your assumptions contributed to this thread whatsoever.

What assumptions?

Tesla has already received a tax payer bailout, to the tune of $465 million. They paid it back of course, but would a company that you or I funded be saved if it were to go bankrupt like Tesla did? They're bleeding cash like a sieve now too, and when the next inevitable downturn in the economy comes again, how much will it take to bailout this green queen next time?

The current cars are still having drivetrain issues. All you have to do is browse the Tesla car forums for plenty of examples of owners having their batteries and drive units replaced with as little as 10k miles on the car.

The man occupying the White House is indeed a liar. These aren't "assumptions", his number of lies are numerous and easily verifiable.

Finally, the resale value is only "guaranteed" (lol) for 36 months. The value of these cars is going to drop off a cliff after that. So it's fine for the original owners, but after that, good luck trying to sell an expensive sedan with enormously expensive batteries and other drive components that fail regularly.

I know this will probably go in one ear and out the other, as I've discovered over the years that Tesla huggers are like a cult.

[ddk632]

I think all new tech has teething issues. The question is will they be able to resolve them and survive and then thrive in the market, or will the issues take them down?