BMW i5 and 5-Series Forum

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-23-2023, 10:34 PM   #1299
Conissah
Major
Conissah's Avatar
1578
Rep
1,048
Posts

Drives: 2018 M3
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Charlotte, NC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2023G87M2 View Post
Does anyone here know how much non fasy charging costs at home to get to 80% in an average kwh battery pack with average electric prices?
We can do some basic math.

Let's run it off the 2023 Chevy Bolt which has a 65kW battery. Let's also assume you're at 10% charge, which means you have 6.5kW stored. 80% of 65 is 55.25kW, a differential of 48.75kW (let's just say 49). A crappy charger will be around 70% efficiency, so to charge that 49kW you will actually use 63.7kW. My average cost per kW is around $0.13, so multiply that by 63.7 and we get $8.28. If we went from 10% to 100% assuming the same 70% efficiency, it would be a 58.5kW differential which would actually consume 76kW and would cost $9.88. These are rough numbers.

HOWEVER, something else to consider is when you actually charge. If it's at peak times, the kW rate is much higher, and if it's in the middle of the night (which is when we charged our EV) it's MUCH lower, sometimes half. We left our EV plugged in almost constantly, and in the car we just set a charge timer so it would only charge between 10pm and 7am.

ALSO something to think about, range degredation due to cold weather. Our EV sat outside, and during the winter we lost ~30% total range just because the battery was cold. In our Bolt that was a reduction from 240 miles down to 170... While ICE vehicles lose some MPG during cold weather, it's nowhere near 30%.
Appreciate 3
M5Rick70906.00
Patton2502946.50
kyriian961.00
      02-24-2023, 05:01 AM   #1300
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conissah View Post
We can do some basic math.

Let's run it off the 2023 Chevy Bolt which has a 65kW battery. Let's also assume you're at 10% charge, which means you have 6.5kW stored. 80% of 65 is 55.25kW, a differential of 48.75kW (let's just say 49). A crappy charger will be around 70% efficiency, so to charge that 49kW you will actually use 63.7kW. My average cost per kW is around $0.13, so multiply that by 63.7 and we get $8.28. If we went from 10% to 100% assuming the same 70% efficiency, it would be a 58.5kW differential which would actually consume 76kW and would cost $9.88. These are rough numbers.

HOWEVER, something else to consider is when you actually charge. If it's at peak times, the kW rate is much higher, and if it's in the middle of the night (which is when we charged our EV) it's MUCH lower, sometimes half. We left our EV plugged in almost constantly, and in the car we just set a charge timer so it would only charge between 10pm and 7am.

ALSO something to think about, range degredation due to cold weather. Our EV sat outside, and during the winter we lost ~30% total range just because the battery was cold. In our Bolt that was a reduction from 240 miles down to 170... While ICE vehicles lose some MPG during cold weather, it's nowhere near 30%.
Good point, cold weather is one achilles heel of an EV, 30% loss is massive and causes worry when away from home when it's chilly.

Last edited by M5Rick; 02-24-2023 at 06:25 AM..
Appreciate 0
      02-24-2023, 08:09 AM   #1301
zx10guy
Brigadier General
5555
Rep
3,354
Posts

Drives: 2013 135i
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: DC

iTrader: (0)

And the variation in any MPG between summer and winter is typically due to formulation changes of the fuels delivered to the pump. Not due to ICE operation itself.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lups View Post
We might not be in an agreement on Trump, but I'll be the first penis chaser here to say I'll rather take it up in the ass than to argue with you on this.
Appreciate 1
chad86tsi1605.00
      02-24-2023, 08:22 AM   #1302
kyriian
Captain
kyriian's Avatar
961
Rep
718
Posts

Drives: 06 Black Sapphire Z4MR
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Ontario

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW X5  [0.00]
2011 Scion tC  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
I can show you with real data from keeping fuel consumption records on my E90 for hundreds of thousands of miles, wintertime MPG is not statistically discernible from non-winter months.

Winter range is why I did not switch to EV when I was commuting 165 miles a day to my office. With no place to charge at the office building during the day to recover range, no EV back 10 years ago had enough winter range to make the round trip. Most today still don't have enough winter range. If they do, there are numerous ICE for $20K less that make for better commuters.

When your commute is already 1 hour 45 minutes one way, sitting at some Super charger or DC Fast Charger on the trip home for an extra 30 to 45 minutes to regain enough range is a non starter; you just want to get the eff home. Adding 5 minutes twice a week to your commuting time to refuel ICE is completely acceptable. On top of that, you have zero reserve to run errands during the day, meet at a client's site, or even just go to lunch with your work wife.
It's okay, 2035 is coming regardless of your problems apparently...
__________________
Revolution of our Times

I will return to the track, one day.
Appreciate 1
KRS_SN14906.00
      02-24-2023, 08:58 AM   #1303
KRS_SN
Major General
KRS_SN's Avatar
United Kingdom
14906
Rep
5,635
Posts

Drives: IX,G07
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Glasgow

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 X7  [10.00]
X5  [9.25]
IX  [8.67]
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyriian View Post
It's okay, 2035 is coming regardless of your problems apparently...
the current ev's will probably be so dinosaurian in comparison by then
Appreciate 0
      02-24-2023, 09:48 AM   #1304
mr2t
Private
89
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: BMW 335
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: TN

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KRS_SN View Post
the current ev's will probably be so dinosaurian in comparison by then
Well batteries in current vehicles will all be dead and too expensive to replace. It's also unlikely anything replaces lithium ion.
Appreciate 0
      02-24-2023, 02:24 PM   #1305
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

Reading on with this is that EV's won't even become modern classics as all those batteries will-be-dead. EV baby dinasaurs not even reaching maturity There is a solution: don't buy them.
Appreciate 0
      02-24-2023, 03:26 PM   #1306
Patton250
Colonel
Patton250's Avatar
2947
Rep
2,538
Posts

Drives: BMW X3,M5,Turbo S
Join Date: May 2021
Location: Tampa

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Efthreeoh View Post
Who said I had any problems? I just added another 200,000 miles on to my E90. Zero range anxiety. 100% reliability and bitchin' to drive. I bet I spent less time maintaining the E90 at its advanced age and mileage than sitting at a charge sucking up juice for 30 mins a day.

Lol.
You have to keep in perspective what some of these guys mean, my friend. They are very pleased with the idea that electric vehicles are being mandated. Not particularly because they are excited with the technology. No, sir. Mostly because human beings were created to worship an authority and some people just worship different types of authority. I think you get my meaning.
Appreciate 1
KRS_SN14906.00
      02-25-2023, 02:28 PM   #1307
KRS_SN
Major General
KRS_SN's Avatar
United Kingdom
14906
Rep
5,635
Posts

Drives: IX,G07
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Glasgow

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 X7  [10.00]
X5  [9.25]
IX  [8.67]
https://www.euronews.com/green/2023/...e-pushing-back

Italian Minister for Transport Matteo Salvini has called the new law economic “suicide” for the EU. He said it was “ideological fundamentalism” that would benefit China and harm the European car industry.
Appreciate 0
      02-25-2023, 04:55 PM   #1308
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

Instead of UK, Brit drivers should put EU FU on their cars.
Appreciate 2
Patton2502946.50
      02-25-2023, 06:49 PM   #1309
KRS_SN
Major General
KRS_SN's Avatar
United Kingdom
14906
Rep
5,635
Posts

Drives: IX,G07
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Glasgow

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 X7  [10.00]
X5  [9.25]
IX  [8.67]
FCUK got there first...

https://www.current-news.co.uk/ice-b...en-point-plan/
Appreciate 1
M5Rick70906.00
      02-25-2023, 07:04 PM   #1310
BGM-M3COMP
The Ben Shapiro of this place. I never lose! LOL
BGM-M3COMP's Avatar
2334
Rep
3,021
Posts

Drives: 12 plaids on order
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Tesla Land

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
“Tesla has transformed the market with brilliant electric cars. As others race to catch up, it’s an important signal to the market that the UK will no longer welcome dirty diesels and petrol cars from 2030".


he he he.
__________________
2035 on the move!!! lmaooooooooo
Appreciate 0
      02-26-2023, 11:03 AM   #1311
pikkagtr
Go Spurs Go
pikkagtr's Avatar
3998
Rep
2,919
Posts

Drives: '22 GR Z4 Coup '06 Z4M Rdster
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Bay Area

iTrader: (-1)

Off peak charging rates is a thing NOW
When EVs become a larger part of the market say 2035
If 50% of the new cars are EV, the electric companies will know they got you by the short hairs
They can change their rates to maximize profit
For a normal Household, they can track usage based on load
Not charging a 100kwhr battery is one price
Charge your EV and put load on the circuit, a different higher price
Imagine paying more to charge your EV than paying for gas would be a reality soon in the future
Appreciate 2
Cos270610.00
      02-26-2023, 11:07 AM   #1312
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KRS_SN View Post
The fat pos at the time only brought it in b/c his greenie wifey told him she would divorce him if he didn't
Old news that and the EU is on borrowed time with it's over the top rulings.
Appreciate 1
KRS_SN14906.00
      02-26-2023, 02:08 PM   #1313
Patton250
Colonel
Patton250's Avatar
2947
Rep
2,538
Posts

Drives: BMW X3,M5,Turbo S
Join Date: May 2021
Location: Tampa

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BGM-M3COMP View Post
“Tesla has transformed the market with brilliant electric cars. As others race to catch up, it’s an important signal to the market that the UK will no longer welcome dirty diesels and petrol cars from 2030".


he he he.
I guess they will just have to fire up a few dozen more coal fired power plants to help charge all these mandatory electric vehicles.
Appreciate 3
M5Rick70906.00
      02-26-2023, 03:09 PM   #1314
KRS_SN
Major General
KRS_SN's Avatar
United Kingdom
14906
Rep
5,635
Posts

Drives: IX,G07
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Glasgow

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 X7  [10.00]
X5  [9.25]
IX  [8.67]
Quote:
Originally Posted by M5Rick View Post
The fat pos at the time only brought it in b/c his greenie wifey told him she would divorce him if he didn't
Old news that and the EU is on borrowed time with it's over the top rulings.
The guys got plenty of ex wife's plenty of kids and preaches to folk about green. I can think of another middle aged podgy dude who is similar and wants to save the world.
Appreciate 1
M5Rick70906.00
      02-26-2023, 05:22 PM   #1315
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KRS_SN View Post
The guys got plenty of ex wife's plenty of kids and preaches to folk about green. I can think of another middle aged podgy dude who is similar and wants to save the world.
KS will be doing the middle classes no favours like this present lot.

Here's another problem of many the gov. hasn't thought of.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/2152...electric-cars/

Last edited by M5Rick; 02-27-2023 at 05:56 AM..
Appreciate 0
      02-27-2023, 08:22 PM   #1316
Murf the Surf
Captain
Murf the Surf's Avatar
21930
Rep
632
Posts

Drives: Porsche 993
Join Date: Mar 2022
Location: Port Carling, Muskoka

iTrader: (0)

Why do I get the feeling that the whole EV thing just isn't ready for Prime Time. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...-dover-calais/
Appreciate 1
M5Rick70906.00
      02-28-2023, 04:37 AM   #1317
M5Rick
General
M5Rick's Avatar
70906
Rep
22,637
Posts

Drives: M5 F10 DCT Gunmetal
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: GB

iTrader: (0)

^ The well known term of 'sh*t show' is evident with our clueless leaders and the blinkers will have to come down soon.
Appreciate 1
      02-28-2023, 08:08 AM   #1318
kyriian
Captain
kyriian's Avatar
961
Rep
718
Posts

Drives: 06 Black Sapphire Z4MR
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Ontario

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW X5  [0.00]
2011 Scion tC  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by M5Rick View Post
^ The well known term of 'sh*t show' is evident with our clueless leaders and the blinkers will have to come down soon.
But apparently its coming in 2035 and nothing can be done about it, be a part of it or.... something
__________________
Revolution of our Times

I will return to the track, one day.
Appreciate 1
Cos270610.00
      02-28-2023, 08:12 AM   #1319
Murf the Surf
Captain
Murf the Surf's Avatar
21930
Rep
632
Posts

Drives: Porsche 993
Join Date: Mar 2022
Location: Port Carling, Muskoka

iTrader: (0)

I get government can regulate things, but something as big as transportation and individual needs makes it seem that supply and demand will be an issue. Government can force manufacturers to build EV's but it's difficult to force people to buy them. I guess I'm saying that there is a certain percentage of the population who don't care what they drive and they will buy what's available but there is also a significant group that are likely to not want to buy an EV. If car manufactures can't sell them what happens then?
Appreciate 3
KRS_SN14906.00
Patton2502946.50
M5Rick70906.00
      02-28-2023, 08:30 AM   #1320
Alfisti
Brigadier General
7014
Rep
3,313
Posts

Drives: 2008 Saab 9-3 Combi
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Toronto, Canada

iTrader: (0)

There really is no debate in Canada, once governments let PHEV's in under the legislation them there's no issue, the regulations will be met. It really is that simple.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:46 AM.




g60
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST