[Savory]

Originally Posted by swanson

Love this car. Back to the drawing board, BMW.

Love the car (so far) as well. But not sure how you can make such a statement so early on when there are very little known metrics about the car's performance besides HP numbers and 0-60 data, and no known publication has driven it and given their initial impressions. Unless of course you are talking purely aesthetics.

On another note, really tragic Merc is too chicken to provide to provide a manual. The wagon with a stick would be very compelling.

[SM335i]

C63 > M3/M4

[Slops]

did i read that right? 34mpg?

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Unfortunately you won't find something like that in a 3-Series anytime soon, which shows the difference between what a 3-Series is vs. what a C-Class is supposed to be. I wish BMW would implement the B&O system in all their models as an option.

No, the 3 series interior actually got cheaper in material while Merc is setting class standards that BMW simply cannot compete with. The C300/400 were nicer than the M3/4 despite being 30K cheaper, LOL.

[jzmundy]

Originally Posted by Slops

did i read that right? 34mpg?

Imperial gallon

[Billup]

I really have been debating a Merc after it's time to retire the 128.

I love what Merc has been putting out lately, and I think this car is gorgeous. Grant it, it's outside of what I would spend (heh), but it still reflects on their other models that would be great to DD in comfort and style. BMW, not so much anymore.

[Slops]

Originally Posted by jzmundy

Imperial gallon

Ahh ok, so thats not too bad either, because the 34.5mpg translates to a US 28.7 mpg.

[jzmundy]

Originally Posted by Slops

Ahh ok, so thats not too bad either, because the 34.5mpg translates to a US 28.7 mpg.

Yep, still not bad at all!

I will still ultimately go with the F8x (probably), but I'm honestly glad to see the competition matching and exceeding BMW's offerings.

[Razzy]

The new C63 will sport the AMG MCT (multi-clutch, in place of torque converter) SpeedShift Transmission. An updated version of the one that is on the current W204 C63.

No true dual clutch here. I think it looks nice but not as butch as the current one due to all the soft edges and curving going on. I'm curious to see how the 4.0 TT V8 is in the sound and response department along with the steering feel of the car. AMG is going the all electric steering route that is the norm these days.

My 2012 C63 Performance Pack (Mercedes-AMG now calls it the S-model now) is other worldly in the throttle response, steering feel and sound department. The last of the NA 6.2 V8's.

[ybbiz34]

Originally Posted by Razzy

The new C63 will sport the AMG MCT (multi-clutch, in placw of torque converter) SpeedShift Transmission. An updated one version of the one that is on the current W204 C63.

No true dual clutch here. I think it looks nice but not as butch as the current one due to all the soft edges and curving going on. I'm curious to see how the 4.0 TT V8 is in the sound and response department along with the steering feel of the car. AMG is going the all electric steering route that is the norm these days.

My 2012 C63 Performance Pack (Mercedes-AMG now calls it the S-model now) is other worldly in the throttle response, steering feel and sound department. The last of the NA 6.2 V8's.

We're in a nice spot. Hang on to the LCI W204 for a few years. See what the W205 LCI offers.

I must say, I do feel the tug of that interior though. Seats look amazing, once again. So does the steering wheel, HUD, etc.

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

No, the 3 series interior actually got cheaper in material while Merc is setting class standards that BMW simply cannot compete with. The C300/400 were nicer than the M3/4 despite being 30K cheaper, LOL.

Maybe (and that's a huge maybe) things will change with the GXX 3-Series but I don't expect BMW to do anything to the 3-Series. Everybody wants this and that in a car but eventually you'll have to take it for what it is, not trying to hope it becomes something it isn't.

I'm not going to go into deep discussion about this but you as a customer has to decide what you're willing to pay for. With the C-Class you're paying for the luxury, with the 3-Series you're still paying for the chassis. With one car, it's obvious what you're paying for because you can see and feel it, the other one you have to actually be driving to see what you're paying for. Which one is worth it to you?

[Razzy]

Originally Posted by ybbiz34

We're in a nice spot. Hang on to the LCI W204 for a few years. See what the W205 LCI offers.

I must say, I do feel the tug of that interior though. Seats look amazing, once again. So does the steering wheel, HUD, etc.

Yes definitly. The last of the 6.2 V8's along with the upgraded power and goodies that come along with the P31 package made it a must buy. It really is the last of the breed. I love it and I intend to hold on to her for some time.

[BMW269]

I think I'd still pick the M3 which I don't like, over this.

[TXSTYLE]

Originally Posted by Savory

On another note, really tragic Merc is too chicken to provide to provide a manual. The wagon with a stick would be very compelling.

I am pretty confident they purposely choose NOT to have a manual.

For what? Like other obsolete things from yesterday... No need.

Before anyone gets butt-hurt from my comment, I took my Drivers Test at 17 in a manual. My first 4-5 cars were manual. But in this day and age, it really is too cumbersome and a real PITA especially in traffic. Unless you have some Classic Car or Race Car that you actually RACE, there's simply no need for a manual. These DCT and Auto-Manuals are so much sweeter.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by ybbiz34

We're in a nice spot. Hang on to the LCI W204 for a few years. See what the W205 LCI offers.

I must say, I do feel the tug of that interior though. Seats look amazing, once again. So does the steering wheel, HUD, etc.

Or you can join the revolution and buy the W205. I'm having a hard time deciding if I want a coupe this time around or sedan. Did you see how good the coupe rendering looked!?

Great problem to have nonetheless.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Maybe (and that's a huge maybe) things will change with the GXX 3-Series but I don't expect BMW to do anything to the 3-Series. Everybody wants this and that in a car but eventually you'll have to take it for what it is, not trying to hope it becomes something it isn't.

I'm not going to go into deep discussion about this but you as a customer has to decide what you're willing to pay for. With the C-Class you're paying for the luxury, with the 3-Series you're still paying for the chassis. With one car, it's obvious what you're paying for because you can see and feel it, the other one you have to actually be driving to see what you're paying for. Which one is worth it to you?

That may have been true with the e9x, but with the F3x generation, out of the box without any M Sport goodies, the chassis is absolutely terrible. Body leans and rolls in corners, absolutely no feedback from the steering wheel, and the car is a lot softer I would compare the way it floats to a Lexus.

[ybbiz34]

Originally Posted by Rev ///Me

Or you can join the revolution and buy the W205. I'm having a hard time deciding if I want a coupe this time around or sedan. Did you see how good the coupe rendering looked!?

Great problem to have nonetheless.

I'm not going to lie. It's very, very hard to resist the pull of this new car. I love every aspect of it. Cannot wait to drive it.

[Wolfinwolfsclothing]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Maybe (and that's a huge maybe) things will change with the GXX 3-Series but I don't expect BMW to do anything to the 3-Series. Everybody wants this and that in a car but eventually you'll have to take it for what it is, not trying to hope it becomes something it isn't.

I'm not going to go into deep discussion about this but you as a customer has to decide what you're willing to pay for. With the C-Class you're paying for the luxury, with the 3-Series you're still paying for the chassis. With one car, it's obvious what you're paying for because you can see and feel it, the other one you have to actually be driving to see what you're paying for. Which one is worth it to you?

I disagree you're paying for a chasis when the f30 chasis hasnt proven to be all that great.
The 435 lost to a very old S5 chasis despite being brand new and by the end of its generation the C63 was as good or better chasis than the e92 m3. The LCI C63 was faster around the Ring, and the C63 Black Series was a better car than the M3 GTS even at 4000 lbs + and even on VIR, the C63 Black is much faster than the M4 despite the M4 having run its lap on a freshly paved track.
Having owned Porsches and M cars by and large for all of my years having a license, I def value what I feel when I drive but also like a cabin that is luxurious to go with it (i.e Porsche).

[TheBingoBalls]

Originally Posted by Rev ///Me

That may have been true with the e9x, but with the F3x generation, out of the box without any M Sport goodies, the chassis is absolutely terrible. Body leans and rolls in corners, absolutely no feedback from the steering wheel, and the car is a lot softer I would compare the way it floats to a Lexus.

Originally Posted by Wolfinwolfsclothing

I disagree you're paying for a chasis when the f30 chasis hasnt proven to be all that great.
The 435 lost to a very old S5 chasis despite being brand new and by the end of its generation the C63 was as good or better chasis than the e92 m3. The LCI C63 was faster around the Ring, and the C63 Black Series was a better car than the M3 GTS even at 4000 lbs + and even on VIR, the C63 Black is much faster than the M4 despite the M4 having run its lap on a freshly paved track.
Having owned Porsches and M cars by and large for all of my years having a license, I def value what I feel when I drive but also like a cabin that is luxurious to go with it (i.e Porsche).

Again, not going to debate this because there is someone who owns a F30 here and will say otherwise and it's going to become a huge debate. But whether you like the F30 or not, it probably is still more dynamic/more driver orientated (not just track times but actual feel) than the Audi or Mercedes, just not as much as it did with the E9X.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

Originally Posted by TheBingoBalls

Again, not going to debate this because there is someone who owns a F30 here and will say otherwise and it's going to become a huge debate. But whether you like the F30 or not, it probably is still more dynamic/more driver orientated (not just track times but actual feel) than the Audi or Mercedes, just not as much as it did with the E9X.

There are two people that own a F30 here. I currently drive an F30 2014 320 xDrive. Test drove the base 328 and 335 as well. No improvement.

[tallshortguy]

Originally Posted by Rev ///Me

There are two people that own a F30 here. I currently drive an F30 2014 320 xDrive. Test drove the base 328 and 335 as well. No improvement.

The only thing the M-sport or sport will change is the suspension, x-drive comes with the standard, softer suspension. The rest of the m-sport stuff does not affect the chassis. The chassis itself is superior to the e90, the difference is the standard suspension.

[TSM330i]

Originally Posted by Slops

Ahh ok, so thats not too bad either, because the 34.5mpg translates to a US 28.7 mpg.

Testing isn't exactly comparative either. You'd have to drop approximately another 20% off the 28.7 mpg to get the US equivalent.


What I find humorous about the C63 is that Mercedes "dropped" the BIG 6.2 liter V8 in favour of a smaller 4.0 liter TT V8.
BMW booted the 4.0 liter V8 to go to a smaller TT I6. We'll see what BMW comes out with in a manner of CSL or GT4 model. BMW still has a weight advantage for track use.